To Those Christians Who Still Support Trump, Help Me Understand

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The election is over, thankfully.

You voted for Donald Trump to be named president of the United States, he won.

As much as I personally disliked this result, I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, so I waited. Maybe there was something I was completely missing. Perhaps, Donald Trump was in reality an entirely different person than his campaign persona. Maybe, what you believed, many of us simply could not see, and Donald Trump is truly a God-send for our country, but needed to carry himself in certain controversial ways to get elected. Therefore, overtime, Donald Trump would shed his campaign skin and the real man, anointed by God, would emerge and all would clearly see it.

Yet, here we are, the election is over, we’re well into his presidency, and Donald Trump is absolutely no different—no more presidential, no less arrogant, no less divisive. I could list much more—nothing of him has changed, if anything, it has become worse.

So when I see your continued Christian support, I’m trying to understand, but finding it very difficult.

From what I know of your brand of Christianity, following Jesus and His example is primary. You are well versed at calling attention to perceived sin, you hold your understanding of moral purity as the highest standard from which to discern the favor and presence of God in ones life, and you have no lack of courage in condemning an American culture you deem to be filled with every form of lust, evil, and offense to God. Within your own churches and ministries, those who desire leadership are highly screened and continually discerned for alignment with the commands of God and a lifestyle faithful to Scripture. And above all, you believe our nation to be uniquely blessed by a God who has no hesitation in withdrawing Himself from anything or anyone who doesn’t honor His will, character, and ways. Is that not true?

And yet you still passionately support Donald Trump—not just the office of president, but the person soon to be occupying it.

Help me understand.

Did it all just magically go away? Where’s your sensitivity to sin and lack of Godly character, now? Where is your condemnation of moral impurity, now? Where is your concern for the removal of God’s favor upon our nation in the face of continued carnal leadership, now?

Help me understand.

Many of you have children—what will your response to them be one day when your son or daughter asks of you, “Dad, did you really vote for and continue to support a man who publicly made fun of special needs children, bragged about grabbing women by the “pussy,” spoke of them as being a “piece of ass,” and continually used his platform to childishly bully people with whom he disagrees?” For your sake, I hope that moment of curiosity doesn’t arise during family devotion time, that would be awkward. You cringe at the thought of allowing your children to attend an r-rated movie, accidentally listening to a vulgar song, or playing an immoral video game at a friend’s house, but apparently have little-to-no hesitation in supporting an x-rated president.

Help me understand.

How do you even begin to justify that, especially within your faith that confesses to be so centered on Jesus?

Donald Trump couldn’t even pass the basic screening to volunteer in your church’s children’s ministry, but he still receives your full Christian support as the president of the United States? He couldn’t qualify for the simple role of Elder in your church for lack of character and self-control alone, and yet you continue to display t-shirts, hats, and signs bowing to his name as the leader of your “one nation under God?” I would suspect that many parents, if they were honest, wouldn’t even feel good about him coaching the local girls “Upward” Basketball team, or even the boys, and yet he still receives your allegiance and is the object of your national hope?

Help me understand.

I would be hard pressed to find a pastor in your faith tradition who wouldn’t normally see Jesus’ “Sermon on the Mount” as the height of His declaration as to what following Him should look like—the fruits of a genuine person of faith and the desires of God upon the earth for all people and nations.

Here are the opening verses…

Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him, and he began to teach them. He said:

“Blessed are the poor in spirit,
    for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn,
    for they will be comforted.
Blessed are the meek,
    for they will inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
    for they will be filled.
Blessed are the merciful,
    for they will be shown mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart,
    for they will see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers,
    for they will be called children of God.
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,
    for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

It doesn’t get any clearer—this is the Jesus you profess to worship, this is the essence of the Kingdom you pray will come, this is the vision of God for all people and all things under heaven and earth.

So, help me understand, where does Donald Trump even begin to match any of this in character, vision, attitude, or example?

Where do we see Donald Trump being truly humble, and genuinely empathizing with and honoring those who aren’t privileged? Where do we see Donald Trump mourning for the oppressed, abused, marginalized, outcast, and religiously condemned within our culture? Where do we see Donald Trump displaying and valuing meekness over imperialism, greed, and power? Where do we see Donald Trump thirsting for self-controlled, Christ-righteous leadership beginning with his own? Where do we see  Donald Trump being merciful with those whom he disagrees, has taken offense, or perceives as an enemy—or ever worse, an immigrant or Islam believer? Where do we see Donald Trump striving for purity of heart over insecurity and impulsiveness? Where do we see Donald Trump using his Twitter feed, let alone his presidency for the goal of Jesus-exampled, sword-less peacemaking?

Instead—homophobic, narcissistic, racist, sexist, xenophobic, greedy, vulgar, arrogant, bullying, and childish seem to be more in line with his be-attitudes.

Please help me understand.

For how can you, as a Christian, continue to unequivocally support a man, no less the president elect of the United States, who represents so much of what Jesus, the Christ, opposes?

To be sure, no one is perfect. Donald Trump is my president by nature of my proud citizenship and civic respect, and will receive my prayers, love, and best wishes, but he reflects very little of the Jesus of my faith understanding and what I believe are His desires for our nation and world.

Which leaves me with a good bit of wondering and questioning—how is it, that Donald Trump could possible reflect yours?

To those Christians who still support Donald Trump, help me understand.

228 Comments

  1. If you get a good answer I hope you’ll share it.
    ;o)

    • ckratzer

      January 2, 2017 at 7:31 pm

      the article is a few hours old at this point, let’s see what happens! 🙂

      • There is no comparison for a political figure and Our Lord needed. Voters voted for President Trump because we are tired of the corruption of our Government and the Bush’s and the Clinton’s and the Obama’s have been tearing down this country for years !!! I am a Christian. I am against abortion. I do pray everyday for our Country and Our Leaders. I believe in the 10 Commandment and allowing prayer in our schools. It used to be the big stigma if the President Elect was not a Veteran or never served in a war. Now the stigma is what their marriage and or divorce is. Donald Trump has not taken office yet. I am sure he will have a rude awakening when he finally gets in the white house. Remember, he is a spoiled rich kid. He throws tantrums………He says things we are not accustomed to hearing coming out of a Polished Politician………..and that is what we liked about him. He does not play their political games. Give him a chance, and pray everyday that God will put the light in his eyes. His personal behavior, God will judge later, but for now, we need someone to take charge and get this Country on it’s feet again. He does love America, he wants to make it better, he wants to straighten out what has been done to this Country. Don’t Judge him before he even gets in office. You should not be judging his personal life any how if you are truly a Christian. He is a business man, he is putting people in his Cabinet that are financially educated to get us out of this mess. We as America cannot be the babysitter of the world anymore. He is for everyone paying their fare share………meaning (everyone) all the other countries. We need a chance to get on our feet again. We need to get America back to what it once was……….an English speaking, God fearing Nation of people who all help each other and get along and want to make America great again. He is against drugs and we need to get them out of our Country and stop them from coming in because they are killing our young people. We need One Nation Under God Again. That’s my hope and prayer for these coming next four years. If he does not produce that, then in the next election we can find someone who will. Pray every day that this will help America. Pray everyday that he will find guidance. He may not be able to control the things he says because he has been allowed to be that way because he was rich, and who would cross him? Let’s not forget, he does not need the money, he could be out making more money, but he has taken on the challenge of making this Country better than it has ever been. It’s a great Challenge to him. Deep down he wants to rebuild this County………it will be his greatest achievement. If he can do it, it will be better than any high rise or “golden” building he has ever built. He strives to do better. He wants better for our Country. He is not a whimp by any means. If he seems vulgar at times……….it’s because that is what he has lived with all his life. I pray he will get a better understanding for what a true American is and become a better man in the process. He is still in anger mode because of all the bashing he took from the News Media and the people who wanted to continue down the same path of destruction. Let’s give him a chance and pray to God that he takes him by the shoulders and guides him into a better light.

        • Elizabeth Thatcher

          January 10, 2017 at 8:12 pm

          Oh, Bonitalia….. I have a bridge I’d like to sell you……….

        • you bring up drugs, but other countries have proven that legalizing drugs actually brings down the death toll. this is because it takes drugs out of the hands of thugs and right into the hands of health providers. This in and of itself regulates the drug world, because professionals who have studied for 10+ years are prescribing, instead of the random hoodlum on the street. Cocaine used to be prescribed for toothaches. Marijuana helps cancer patients live a fuller life. If prohibition tells us anything, its that taking away something full-tilt does absolutely no good, because the people who want it are going to get it anyways. Might as well be in small, controllable doses prescribed by a doctor who can also see and recommend treatment if abuse happens.

    • I am a Christian and the the answer for me is very easy. I voted for Trump, not because he embodied what I as a Christian cherish and want my president to be like. I voted for Trump because the other choice was miles worse in every single character trait and position that matter the most.

      • ckratzer

        January 7, 2017 at 2:14 pm

        Very honest answer, Carlos. Thanks for reading and commenting. My only reply, other than the article itself would be… there were other choices.

        • Sure there were, but my goal was to keep Hillary out as I found he more damaging. thought voting for those that had no chance was as good as not voting at all. If I was voting for a new pastor, my criteria would have been different, I was not. I was voting for whom I thought had a better agenda for the future. What Hillary offered was not the direction I thought this great country needs. Time will tell if a Trump will be any good.

      • That is complete horse crap. The obvious Christian in the race was Hillary Clinton, who spent her whole life fighting for families and children and who supported all of the best values this nation has stood for. People like you believe things about her that are totally ridiculous and have zero basis in reality. Thanks for being so ignorant and unable to see what was right in front of your face and helped elect the most frightening and unfit President we’ll ever have.

        • Thank you Dave….I do believe the values we all desire are absolutely out of the grasp of DJT. There is nothing Christian, Godly or collectively conscious in anything he has done or said. “Making America Great Again” is a mantra for madness. President Obama is a civil, kind, educated, thinking person, who taught Constitutional Law for 12 years….putting him in a position of preparedness no other President has ever had. He has produced no marital or monitary, or moral scandals. He has brought the country back from an “almost” depression and given us the beginnings of a healthcare system that we should have had many many years before. He has been judge for the color of his skin….not anything else!!! How possibly can anyone make the assumption DJT will fulfill all their secret desires…how. His total record his entire life is a lie. He is the anti-Christ with bragging about how he treats women, employees and contractors, architects, workmen, and just about anyone he has any dealing with. And they think he can make this country great again??? HOW???

          • Matthew Hebbert

            January 12, 2017 at 1:29 pm

            “Obama is a civil, kind, educated, thinking person, who taught Constitutional Law for 12 years….”

            …who also dropped over 22,000 bombs on foreign nations in 2016 alone, and murdered scores of innocent foreign civilians over the past eight years, all without any formal declarations of war.

            And Hillary thought he wasn’t aggressive enough.

            War and murder in the name of empire doesn’t sound very Christlike to me.

            Who knows how much blood Trump will get on his hands, but at least he has expressed interest in dialing back the USA’s “nation building” and aggressive foreign policy.

          • Kimbrough Leslie

            January 12, 2017 at 4:25 pm

            While you are correct about the reality of Obama and Clinton re: military policies and actions (not to mention increasing Bush’s assault on civil liberties and privacy) neither proposed increasing the size of the military by 10,000 or more troops, as Trump is preparing to do at the cost of billions or trillions while cutting taxes for the 1% and cutting the already weak (thanks to Bill Clinton) social safety net, Neither are they unhinged, impulsive, thin-skinned amoral, hedonistic, misogynist, xenophobic, homophobic, islamophobic, narcissistic, psychopathic, demagogues who asked why we’ve never used nuclear weapons or planned to put generals into civilian cabinet positions. If you prefer the fire to the frying pan, it’s your blind choice. I suggest being gentle as doves but wise as serpents as a real Christian alternative. No candidate is the Messiah or perfect or deserving of full loyalty, but Bernie Sanders is at least a true populist with genuine empathy and integrity.

        • And like someone else said above, I have a bridge to sell you.

          • Kimbrough Leslie

            March 23, 2017 at 8:57 pm

            Bernie was/is no Messiah, but the only one with a chance to win (before being sabotaged by the clueless, corporately owned DNC) who addressed real issues that affect ordinary people, poor people, and people of color. Never been accused of being gullible or naive.

        • Yes, yes, yes. The hypocrisy of those alleged “Christians” who voted for Trump is breathtaking.

        • Kimbrough Leslie

          April 13, 2017 at 7:37 pm

          While H.C. is a fellow United Methodist (as were G.W. Bush and Cheney), and undoubtedly sincere in her faith and deeply influenced by her church experience, she has a history of being too quick to recommend or resort to military “solutions,” she has brushed off legitimate “Black Lives Matter” concerns. While she has expressed regret about the effects of her part in policies eliminating “welfare as we know it” and drug law sentencing, she has continued to be insensitive and elitist and has thoroughly adopted a Neoliberal social and foreign policy agenda which has had devastating consequences around the world, especially for poor people of color, and now, even for the middle class in the U.S.

  2. This has really nothing to do with me, I live in South Africa. But I think the best of the two candidates won. It is for me unbelievable to think that you want to support someone who is so morally corrupt as Hillary Clinton.
    My question to you is this, have even bothered to ask God what is his plans with Trump as president? Because it seems to me that you did not. As I see it, it God’s will that Trump has won.

    • ckratzer

      January 3, 2017 at 12:00 pm

      Jaco, thanks for your comments and for reading my article. I have never said in this article or any other platform that I supported Hillary Clinton. And yes, I have considered what may or may not be God’s plans. Thanks again for taking the time to share your thoughts.

      • I wonder if we aren’t wasting time rehashing the election.

        Yesterday Congress voted to gut the independent Ethics office. The office created in 2008 when several members were found guilty of corruption and served jail time. This is an independent, bipartisan office. If this stands (the full vote is today) then Congress will decide when Congress is investigated. If this bothers you, you should call your congressional representative today. Seems like any member of Congress, even any Republican, should want to say there are safeguards in place to keep us from even the appearance of corruption.

        Furthermore, rather than rehashing the election, I’d like Christians to be concerned about Bannon, for example. Hillary is out of the picture, and now we have a new administration and congress making decisions. I think its time we look at that, rather than defending our decisions that are now nearly two months behind us.

        • ckratzer

          January 4, 2017 at 12:40 am

          Thank you Tracy for your thoughtful comments!

        • It was good to hear yesterday evening that the House decided to not ratify the previous night’s action. Said they wanted to “study it” more.

          • The names of the congressmen who burned midnight oil in an attempt to eliminate the Independent Ethics Office should be noted and remembered in the next election.

          • Although this was good to hear it was disturbing and disgusting to hear many of them taking credit for “fixing” this wrong direction that they voted to take!

          • Exactly, Andy. Their hubris and hipocracy seems to not recognize any limits. And, there have been instances when I have made the same judgment of some Democrats.

        • I’d add that I think Sessions is also someone who should worry evangelicals. He has called the Voting Rights Act of 1965 (the one Martin Luther King worked so hard for) “too intrusive.” Do we really think it would be good to allow states to return to poll taxes, to other shenanigans to disenfranchise voters?

          Anyway, I’ve made my point. Life moves on, and I’d like to hear that those evangelicals who voted for Trump even if they didn’t like everything he said were still paying attention, and still recognizing they have some responsibility here. We all do.

        • Trump “bullied” them into reversing this decision. Exactly what he should have done, which is why we voted for him.

          • Depending on which news you watch, Congress did not stop their attempt to gut the ethics committee because trump bullied them they did it because Americans jammed the phone lines & every other forms of communication for hours before the vote. There are at least 10 million people out there who voted for someone other than trump….way more than voted for him.

          • And how, Duckdrive, does “bullying” anyone honor Christ? How does it reflect Him? I take it by “we,” you are one the Christians who voted for him. I am a Christian and there was no way I would ever vote for such a man. He is everything the Bible describes as an anti-Christ. So I, too, wonder how my professed brothers and sisters in Christ could support such a man who has spit on everything that Jesus deemed important.

          • So the rules are off now? Do I take it that your sect of Christianity no longer regards personal morals or a moral example as relevant in an elected official? Just practical toughness? Have you denounced the influence of religion in politics? If so, do you also support the first amendment anti-establishment clause?

          • When did bullying become Christian?

          • Well, of course he will take credit, but no, it was the people who spoke. Trump threw in his 2 cents worth after the fact, but you can be sure he will always take credit for anything that makes him look good to his voters whether its true or not.

          • This is the perfect example of fake news. Trump did no such thing. They reversed course because they were flooded with phone calls by citizens who do not trust them, and with good reason, to hold themselves accountable. Trump is at the top of the list of those that should be concerned about ethics violations considering the fact he has none. He has bribed two AG’s in an attempt to get them to drop investigations into his phony University just for starters.
            The man is undeniably morally bankrupt and I suspect isn’t far from it financially either. What I have never understood about the Right is how they can be so easily taken in by talking bobble heads. Actors who have spent a lifetime learning how to play a crowd.
            Clinton certainly wasn’t perfect, she wasn’t my 1st choice but she never defrauded thousands out of millions of dollars, you can question her foundation but dozens of organizations that watch for fraud in non-profits have found it to be on the lvl which is a lot more than you can say about Trumps little money laundering organization. Clinton never got on stage and incited violence as Trump did, offering to pay peoples legal fees to attack protestors, she never sexually assaulted anyone which Trump has a very long and sordid history of. She never made fun of ppl with disabilities as Trump did, she never suggested bombing countries into dust and killing noncombatants along with everyone else. None of the things I’ve listed here are fake news, They were played live on air and seen by millions. The man you voted for is a compulsive liar and cheat. He has been sued over 3,500 times for failure to pay for services rendered. In most cases he settles out of court while he brags about suing others who speak out against him. He’s a bully and a braggart and nothing else. There is nothing moral or Christian about him and there never has been and most likely never will be. He views women as chattel, something to be used and abused for his personal pleasure. He was born with a golden spoon up his rectum and has never had to do an honest days work in his miserable life yet, you and those of you that support him think he actually cares about the problems your having! All I heard from Conservatives leading up to the election was how Trump was going to clean up the corruption on The Hill but he’s managed to appoint the most corrupt bunch of elites the world has ever know to key posts. I’ve been told time and again by you ppl not to pay attention to what he says but rather what he does, I have been and I don’t like it. In fact i’ve been paying attention for many yrs to what the GOP is doing and they have done nothing to serve the needs of the common working man or woman in this country unless you consider making it easier to get your hands on a gun. That, they have been masters at. In the last two yrs there has been a shooting involving a toddler every week, That’s 104 shootings involving children from ages 1-4 in two yrs. If that were going on in any other area, Congress would be legislating their butts off to make sure it didn’t happen again.
            Your leader and his crony’s want to run Gov like a business. Gov. is a non-profit. Conservatives complain constantly about how Gov doesn’t serve their needs, I suspect not. Not when you elect ppl to run it like a corporation in an effort to turn a profit for a small handful. Once again we’re hearing the same old garbage from Conservative leaders, just give more tax breaks to the wealthy and they will provide for us. Funny how we’ve been doing that for the better part of the last 35 yrs but yet our jobs are disappearing overseas and the majority of what’s left won’t pay a living wage. Conservatives claim the corporate Tax rate is too high. Global corporations like GE not only don’t pay any taxes but they get millions in Gov subsidies to boot. How many have offshore’d their profits in an attempt not to pay taxes leaving the common working man and woman to take up the slack? For those that do pay, the corporate Tax rate is 35% but after taking advantage of all the loopholes they pay less than you and I do. Trump himself has bragged about this and wears it like a badge of honor so when he fails to fix the economy, when all those manufacturing jobs fail to re-materialize as he promised , when the stock market crashes again, and it will, and you lose any savings you might have in your 401K, when we are chin deep in yet another endless war that’s costing us trillions f dollars and thousands of American lives, will the illegals that are working low paying dead end jobs matter that much to you then?
            Yea, I’m trying to understand how after 35 yrs of being fed the same lie over and over and falling for it while seeing it fail time and again, ppl can still be so gullible.

          • He did not. He told them they shouldn’t spend the time on this issue right now. They need to concentrate on the repeal of the ACA and tax reform. This issue is only tabled, not removed. The Ethics Committee will indeed be dumped in the first 100 days. I’d wager a large sum on this, too.

          • Belinda Stotler

            January 6, 2017 at 11:30 am

            Trump really didn’t stop anything, nor did he endorse the Office of Congressional Ethics. Here is what he actually wrote in his Tweet: “With all that Congress has to work on, do they really have to make the weakening of the Independent Ethics Watchdog, as unfair as it may be, their number one act and priority. Focus on tax reform, healthcare and so many other things of far greater importance! #DTS”

            Notice he said “as unfair as it may be”. He was more concerned with them wasting time at this issue for the present and rather see them getting to work on his agenda to make the wealthy wealthier.

          • Exactly!

          • Regular citizens called in and expressed their unhappiness. Trump didn’t “bully them” …in fact, he said that he thought they had more important things to do first. Not that they shouldn’t do it at all…just get to it later.

      • You talk about sin…what about abortion? What about pushing same sex marriage, what about allowing transgender people to use restrooms with people of the opposite sex, what about all of the cheating and lying going on with the Liberal candidate and her family? What does the Bible say about supporting Israel? This administration just stabbed God’s people in the back to help out the enemy.
        So you know your Beatitudes, good. We did not appoint God as our president, but, we trust in His choice for whatever reason and a true Christian will trust in what comes out of it, good or bad. God is in control.

        • ckratzer

          January 4, 2017 at 11:38 am

          Bonny, thanks for reading and commenting. Where I agree that abortion is a very difficult issue, I disagree with you on the other areas you mention. I find it interesting how many Christians claim to be pro-life while at the same time they are certainly pro-choice about the Bible–determined to protect their freedom to use every interpretive knife they can contrive to abort countless people into hell, murder their souls with condemnation, and yank them out of the womb of God’s Grace, slicing and dicing them with sin-labels and discrimination like you do in your comment Bonny–all while singing songs to Jesus with a self-righteous smirk on their face.

          • People on either side of the political aisle can contort their morality to fit their view of the world, and still leave God out of the picture. I didn’t vote for Trump because of his egocentric awful vial mouth….I didn’t vote for Hillary because of her many lies and scandals that go back 30 years at least. Deception is the order of the day in politics….money, deceit and arrogance. Not one person high up the ranks in any of the 3 branches of government is honorable, not what honor should be. Throwing one group of people under the bus to elevate another or support another…..this is not Christian at all. America is doomed until REAL Christians that PRACTICE all the Beatitudes, and the Golden Rule, wake up and find better candidates to support for political office AND business leaders. Greed and Pride has taken full root here….

          • ckratzer

            January 5, 2017 at 4:03 pm

            Good thoughts, Sue.

          • Wow! Aborting them to hell? Uh, no. Telling someone it’s not safe to play on the freeway is not the same as pushing them onto it. I have no say on who goes to hell, but I do know that the Bible tells people that certain behaviors are not pleasing to God. Why do non-belivers care so much what Christians say anyway? I don’t care at all what Muslims say about what I should or shouldn’t do. If you don’t like what Christians say, put your fingers in your ears and chant “la-la-la”.

          • Abortion is not a difficult issue at all. It is killing babies. End of story.

          • Paula,
            You ask a very important question: “Why do non-believers care so much what Christians say anyway?” Why indeed? Because you are not content with just sharing the Gospel. You are not just saying things. You are trying to turn your belief into law. Non-believers are not able to just choose to ignore your blabbering by putting their fingers in their ears like a 3-year-old, because if you had your way they would legally HAVE to listen to you.

            To use your analogy… You are not just trying to tell people not to play on the highway. You are trying to make it a crime for them to play on the highway. There is a HUGE difference in those two approaches of evangelism. Rather than sharing Christ and LOVE as Christ commands us and then letting the people choose Christ, you feel the need to make it a law for them to choose to believe the same way you do.

            There is also something inferred in your post that is incorrect and bordering on the verge of ignorant. Being in support of a person’s right to choose for themselves based on their own belief system is not the same as forcing them to have an abortion. Again your analogy, “Telling someone it’s not safe to play on the freeway is not the same as pushing them onto it.” People that are pro-CHOICE are not forcing people to have abortions. The only one in this discussion forcing anyone to do anything is pro-life people, like yourself, wanting to force everyone to believe what they believe and decide accordingly. You are in fact the ones pushing them on to the freeway, not the pro-CHOICE people, it just happens to be your freeway.

            Pro-CHOICE is not by any stretch of the imagination the same as pro-abortion. I am pro-CHOICE, because Christ is pro-CHOICE about the most important decision anyone will make in their lives. Christ doesn’t force people by law to follow Him or believe in Him or agree with Him. He offers His truth through scripture and then each and every one of us CHOOSES to follow Him or not follow Him. If Christ can’t make the most important choice there is for someone, why do you feel that you have the right to make any choice for anyone else? That is mighty egotistical of you…

        • So, Bonny, it follows that you trust that President Obama was God’s choice too for whatever reason because God is in control, right? Perhaps his actions with regard to same-sex marriage, transgender protections, and the vote on Israel’s behaviors are actions anointed by God, and you are not allowing yourself to see the truth for some reason. There are Christians in the United States who believe this to be. What makes them wrong and you right? They read the same Bible and pray as earnestly as you, attend church and try to live by Jesus’ example, too. And they also trust that God chose President Obama, who has had a scandal-free eight years, with no ethical, legal, or moral issues, etc. He seems to me to have been an excellent choice made by God, or does it not count somehow? There is a great danger in declaring a leader as chosen, no matter your political leanings. If Trump was chosen, then so was Obama. You can’t have it both ways.

          • Excellent point, Laurie!

          • Laurie, great points.

          • ckratzer

            January 5, 2017 at 11:57 am

            Laurie, I’m enjoying your insight and ability to hold up a mirror to those who would embrace a double standard.

          • Laurie, I am so happy to see this straightforward reasoning applied here. I do not believe it will change anyone’s mind, of course, but it may help those on the fence to avoid error. Bless your heart.

          • MinnesotaBeliever

            January 6, 2017 at 3:03 am

            That’s what I was going to say. Obama has been great for America. Made us great again. I cringe at what’s to come.

        • Thx for reading this article and responding. First I would like to state that I am a Christian while also strongly disagreeing with Trump. To address your points starting with abortion. As a Christian I in no instance support to concept of abortion. While saying that, I believe in the free will of the people of the United States. Implementing laws like anti-abortion based on purely Christian values just supports the theocracy that our ancestors built this country to escape from. Also, I do not understand becuase some say they love the baby but then they crucify the man. An example of this is typically pro-life advocates also do not support letting in Syrian refugees (this is not all pro-life supporters though). Children’s dead bodies are being washed up on shores in Syria and hundreds of thousands are dying. If you are an advocate of life, then be an advocate of ALL life. The next is homosexuality and transgenders. First, it is a grand mistake of those who just use the vague argument that homosexuality is wrong. Please look at the specific verses. Homosexuality is only mentioned twice in the Bible. the first is in the Old Testament. SO, Jesus has fulfilled this part of the law and we are no longer subject to the Old Covenant. Also right after that verse it says do not cut your hair. So if you believe that we should still follow the Old Covenant, which we do not have to because of the sacrifice of Jesus, then cutting your hair and eating crustaceans is just as much of a sin as homosexuality. The second verse is in the New Testament. It is incorrect for those who simply look at specific parts of the Bible and then just reiterate them. We must look at what those words meant during the period of Jesus. Homosexuality in that period was a Roman concept. It was where older men were encouraged to acquire a younger boy and have as much sex as possible with them. The definition of homosexuality and gay marriage is a complete new concept. Commitment between two of the same gender is NEVER condemned in the Bible. The next is Israel. God never calls for an entire country to support Israel in anyway. I do believe that Israel is the Holy Land but we must look at the situations going on there right now. People from Israel are literally bombing schools full of children and murdering hundreds in Pakistan all in the name of imperialism. God would never encourage this. Next is the corruption. I would never endorse political corruption and never will. The stigma in this election that if you are liberal you support Clinton and her decisions is completely false. Finally, Jesus has called us to love one another as ourselves. When He was asked to basically summarize the Bible in to points, this was the second after love your God. No matter what race, hair color, sexuality, political belief, gender, occupation, country of origin, religion, etc., we are called to love one another. The other- those who are in the minortiy group of race, gender, sexuality, religion, and so on- are already experiencing enough trouble and need a loving, accepting hand from Christians. And I believe that Trump fails to lend this hand to ALL.

          • Hopefulllessness

            January 5, 2017 at 2:43 pm

            I love this response. Thank you for putting into words what I have been thinking, but didn’t quite know how to properly express.

          • This response is incredible and I would like to be your friend.
            My philosophy is that the Bible was written at a specific time, for a specific people for a specific purpose. We have to look at the Bible more critically and you did just that!

        • “Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” (Matthew 22:35-40)

          These are the greatest two commandments. Not “thou shalt make sure all your neighbors marry heterosexually and thou shalt stop them from getting abortions even if it may be best for their health and you don’t actually know their circumstances because it’s none of your business and thou shalt police who uses which bathrooms.
          God so loved the world. And what he asked us to do was love everyone in it. THAT’S what’s important. And that’s the terrifying contradiction we see in our president-elect and his Christian supporters. I too am a Christian. I voted for Sec. Clinton not because I loved everything about her, but because she supports minority groups (or as Jesus calls them, the least of these), and because she has years of government experience that could be valuable. Between two difficult choices, I decided against the man who hates. That’s all I know.

        • I have never understood how people equate support for Israel with allowing Israel to ignore international law and create an apartheid state. One only needs to look to the bible to see that God had no qualms punishing or admonishing Israel about how they behaved and how they treated foreigners and gentiles. Why then is it okay or even admirable for the international community to turn away when Israel treats non-Jews in this way?

          • A friend of mine suggested this interesting thought experiment. What would happen if the nation of Israel laid down all of their arms of war and what would happen if the Palestinians laid down all of their arms of war? Well, in the first case, within very short order the nation of Israel would cease to exists as its hostile neighbors eliminated that nation-state and, if many had their wish, eliminate the Jewish people living in that nation-state. If the Palestinians laid down their arms? Palestinians would continue to be elected to Israel’s Knesset and they would continue to work in Israeli companies and they would continue to live peacefully in Israel.

        • There is a significant difference between God knowing what is to come and God being in complete control. God gave “man” free will. God does not interfere with free will. Thus God is not in complete control of “man’s” actions, “man” is. “Man” needs to stop blaming God for our mistakes and calling it God’s will and start owning our actions. Being “man” comes with accountability and consequences! Guess what “man” makes mistakes, or have you conveniently forgotten the laundry list of them that start with Genisis Chapter 3? God uses “man’s” mistakes to teach “man” and further His plan, but God doesn’t control “man”. “Man” made the mistake of eating from the Tree of Knowledge, not God. “Man” created the complication of the word of God that resulted in the creation of 613 laws when God only gave “man” 10. “Man” chooses over and over to create idols to take the place of God. “Man” is responsible for the enslavement of the Israelites not God. “Man” is responsible for the sin in the world that required God to deliver Christ to die for our sins. “Man” is responsible for the Christian Crusades, not God. “Man” was responsible for the Spanish Inquisition, not God. “Man” was responsible for the enslavement of Africans, not God. “Man” was responsible for the deaths of thousands of Jews in Auschwitz, not God. “Man” was responsible for dropping atomic weapons on Japan, not God. “Man” is responsible for damaging the planet almost beyond repair, not God. And “man”, more specifically 62,979,636 “men” are responsible for the current President-elect, not God. God will use this latest mistake by “man” to teach us and to further his plan in ways we don’t yet understand, but it is quite incorrect to say God elected him. He no more elected the President-elect than he handed the apple to Eve in the Garden of Eden. There is more than one force at work on this planet, the only thing we have going for us is we know that no how horrible our mistakes are, in the end, God wins.

          As for the rest of our clap trap… IF you voted for Trump on the issue of abortion, or gay marriage, or transgender bathrooms you might want to reread the bible. The bible is very clear that ALL sin is equal in God’s eyes, only “man” has decided to make some sins “worse” than others. So if you closed your eyes to Trumps adultery, divorces, cursing, lying, oppression of the poor, cheating of those that work for him, stealing those that buy from him, and the hate and divisiveness that he built is platform on just so you could vote for someone that favors your stand on abortion what does that say about you? You are exactly who this article is written about. Oh and by the way what right do you have to place your belief on abortion or same-sex relationships or gender identity on others? Show me where in the bible it says that we are Christians are given the charge by Christ to right laws to enforce our “religion”. Please show me that verse….

          Until then take some accountability and ownership for the hypocrisy of your version of “Christianity”.

        • God is in control? Ok. Just now, because Trump has been elected (and not the past 8 years)? If so why do you think that? Because “it happened” therefore it is God’s will? Ok then, why was it not God’s will when gay marriage was legalized? Was God unable to stop it? Of course not, right? Because he is all powerful. So why did it happen? Let me guess, he let it happen because it was a test. The truly faithful must rise and fight the gay marriage ruling and return things to Gods will, right? So how do you know the election of Trump is God’s will, or is it another test that we must rise up against? I’m sure the irony and the fact that you yourself are deciding what is God’s will is totally lost upon you.

        • Bonnie, I don’t recall Jesus ever saying anything about transgender use of bathrooms, same-sex marriage, or abortion. Many Christians try to follow what Jesus actually said (help the poor and the sick, love everyone) rather than what political “Christians” tell us is the Christian viewpoint. From this perspective, I considered Bernie Sanders, the only Jew in the race, to have been the most truly Christian of all the major candidates. and Donald Trump to be the least, and I am devastated with the election’s outcome.

        • I don’t believe that “God’s people” is a nation enclosed by man-made borders. I believe it is the people, wherever they may live, who remain faithful to God. And, if you are a Christian, you will believe that Jesus came to change the law of the Old Testament into one that accepts everyone as “God’s people”. Not just those who rely on their genetic lineage or the country they live in.

        • George Nixon Shuler

          July 3, 2017 at 12:25 am

          1. Abortion: I guarantee you nothing Trump will do will change the number of abortions occurring. If you don’t believe in abortion, don’t get one, case closed.
          2. Same Sex marriage: If you don’t believe in it, then don’t marry someone of the same sex.
          3. Transgender people use the correct restroom they choose and pose no threat to others.
          4> “Cheating and lying going on with the Liberal candidate and her family:” Please enumerate. Nothing compared to what’s going on with the Trump family.
          5. Israel of the bible and Israel of today are two different things. American Jews overwhelmingly voted for Clinton. American Nazis overwhelmingly voted for Trump.

    • Hillary’s corruption issue is not a part of this, but in America we are not guilty until proven. God’s putting trump in the white house equates to his putting Hitler in power…no it was our act of free will….God didn’t show up at the polls, we did…or didn’t.

    • How is she corrupt?

    • Just my two cents

      January 4, 2017 at 2:55 pm

      God gave us free will. Humans make mistakes. Are you saying it’s God’s will that Hitler came to power? That millions died under the Khmer Rouge? This is definitely the people’s will, but I wouldn’t presume to put this election under an edict from God. Just as individuals choose to do evil things, I don’t think it’s God’s will that children are raped or murdered, or that Trump was elected. The Bible is full of horrible leaders who came to power. God told the Hebrews that a king would send their sons to war, and was generally a bad idea, but they wanted one anyway, so He gave them Saul, which they later regretted. Free will. Not God’s will, plan, recommendation, or idea. Humans who can be deceived, misguided, and sin, also vote.

    • What is this “morally corrupt “Hillary. I have become acquainted with another recently arrived evangelical South African in my Canadian homeland who spews the same nonsense. What ignorant ideas have your church leaders been dishing out denigrating a great woman of whom even Trump admitted “had done great things and served her country well.” Do South African evangelicals blandly accept every hostile and ignorant concept dished out to you from your pulpits without giving it critical analyses. That truly is the mark of ignorance.

      • The English-speaking world in general is under the thumb of Rupert Murdoch, whose organizations are probably responsible for the slanders of Hillary Clinton in South Africa as in most other places.

        Jaco, you have been duped and deceived. You should reconsider your views and do some diligent research in reliable sources.

    • Antonette DuPree

      January 5, 2017 at 2:04 am

      Jaco Venter, tell me how she’s so much more corrupt than this man? She certainly doesn’t act anything like him, she fought for disabled children to have access to public schools, she has fought for people and devoted her whole life to civic service. What I think is you have no clue what you are talking about. I am really sick of hearing this sorry argument. The comparison of Clinton to Trump is an embarrassment and a false equivalency if I have ever heard one.

    • Morally corrupt? Let’s break this down. Morally, Hillary supports equality for minorities and healthcare for all. The corruption you speak of has not been proven and everything brought against her is nothing more than slanderous accusations.
      God does have a plan for Trump, apparently though. Maybe it’s all for the sake of saving Israel. Maybe it’s to awaken Americans to the truth about hatred. No one knows what God’s plan is for Trump or America, but everything happens for a reason. That doesn’t mean Trump is God’s saving grace to America. So, Mr. Hateful Greedy Trump may, apparently, be in God’s plan but definitely not God’s answer to America.

    • Not Gods will…. try Satans……

    • Monique Johnson

      January 5, 2017 at 1:48 pm

      For the record, I find it offensive that people measure Hillary as morally corrupt. She has lots of baggage, for sure, but I see a moral person who had hopes to help all Americans. Now that the election is over, can we stop beating her with a stick that we do not use on other politicians (especially DT)?

    • Michael Reichert

      January 5, 2017 at 3:21 pm

      There’s one thing to voting for someone who, in your mind, is the lesser of two evils. There’s another to promote him with bumper stickers and hats, etc

    • Elizabeth Thatcher

      January 10, 2017 at 8:15 pm

      Jaco………. I would love to see the sources where you learned how corrupt Hillary Clinton is…….. as I said to Bonitalia, I have a bridge to sell you.

    • I find this argument empty, a spiritual cop-out if you will.
      EVERYTHING that happens on God’s earth is as it is meant to be. The Lord of the Universe does not make mistakes – but this does NOT excuse our personal role in events. The Lord gave us all Free Will, and we are responsible for our use of it, and will answer for our choices on the Day of Judgement.
      If the fact of Trump’s victory is, in itself, proof that it was God’s Will for him to win, then what of Stalin? Pol Pot? Saddam Hussein? Hitler? ALL of these agents of Satan required the consent and support of men and women to complete their evil deeds. No-one that enabled them can simply say “If they achieved leadership then it was God’s Will that they did so, so I supported them”.
      And no, I do NOT believe that Trump is some ‘new Hitler’. I am using exaggeration to illustrate a point. I do not presume to ‘ask God what his plans are’, for ANYTHING. It is not my place (or yours) to question the plans of our Creator. It is our place only to ask ‘What would Jesus do?’, and then emulate His glorious example to the best of our flawed ability.
      I do not believe that Jesus would have supported a divisive, angry, spiteful, arrogant, greedy man such as this. I find it hard to understand how any Christian could believe such a thing.
      Mat 7:16 “By their fruit you will recognize them. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?”
      Of course, Trump is still part of the Lord’s ultimate Plan – EVERYTHING is – but that doesn’t mean we must support him. Sometimes the works of Our Lord is more mysterious than others.
      Is 45:15 “Truly, You are a God who hides Himself, O God of Israel, Savior! “

      • I couldn’t agree more. To add one more thing to what you said: the Anti-Christ will rise to power because mankind allows and even promotes that happening. I believe God’s plan includes the variables that will happen based on our free will. We can take the easy route or the hard route – it’s up to us!

      • That is some high-octane majikal thinkin’ there boss….

  3. For me, the premise is wrong;
    “From what I know of your brand of Christianity, following Jesus and His example is primary. You are well versed at calling attention to perceived sin, you hold your understanding of moral purity as the highest standard from which to discern the favor and presence of God in ones life, and you have no lack of courage in condemning an American culture you deem to be filled with every form of lust, evil, and offense to God. Within your own churches and ministries, those who desire leadership are highly screened and continually discerned for alignment with the commands of God and a lifestyle faithful to Scripture. And above all, you believe our nation to be uniquely blessed by a God who has no hesitation in withdrawing Himself from anything or anyone who doesn’t honor His will, character, and ways. Is that not true?”
    No, it is not true for me.
    I voted for Trump.
    Maybe you miss understand us.

    • ckratzer

      January 3, 2017 at 12:04 pm

      bb, thanks for sharing your thoughts and reflections regarding this article. Where I respect that everyone is unique in their voting motives and that perhaps for you, the questions of this article do not apply, I was once the very person in beliefs as I described in the segment of the article you quoted and was a member one of the largest Christian denominations in the world where thousands of people believe the same and make no apologies for voting for Trump nonetheless. Thanks again for your comments.

  4. copied from a friend;

    “For my liberal friends, gay friends, international friends who don’t understand this outcome and the anti Trump folks… this election is not about Trump or Clinton, it’s about what they represent.

    This election has a hint of anti Hillary and pro Donald but it’s more of a reaction to the over reach of Washington we’ve experienced from both major parties for decades.

    Trump represents the anti establishment mindset. While he certainly has his character flaws, he’s not part of the Washington machine.

    It wasn’t racists, anti gay or right wing nut jobs that pushed this through, it was a bunch of people who are tired of the business of government manipulating our lives, pushing cultural agendas and infringing more and more on the US constitution.”

    • ckratzer

      January 3, 2017 at 12:05 pm

      Again, thanks for your comments bb, appreciate the dialogue and sharing of views.

    • Yes, I’ve heard and read that kind of response frequently. However, I find it somewhat incredulous. A third party vote would have satisfied those desires–Libertarian for instance–or even Bernie (“but eww, he’s a COMMUNIST”) (NOT, ignoramus).

      Trump does not legitimately represent positive change or anti-establishment, rather, he’s a person who is an obvious member of the Rich and Famous and is willing to say anything to grasp the most powerful position in the world.

      BTW, bb, I know you’re quoting others. Not attacking you, rather the ideas.

      • Michael Moore didn’t find it incredulous, or he would not have predicted it for those and similar reasons…in July. He’s as left-liberal as they come. Remove the plank from your eye.

        • “Incredulous” = “hard to believe/without adequate merit”.

          What does Michael Moore’s predictive abilities relative to the insanity of approximately half of the voters have to do with the election of a person who in reality does NOT represent the best interest of “Christian” voters?

          As to third party voting…Voters need to stop playing the Establishment two-party game which is to control the “game theory”.

          I’ll readily admit to the sawdust in my eyes if you’ll take off your sleeping blinders.

          • Actually “incredulous” means “not believing.” A person is incredulous when confronted by a statement they disbelieve.

            As for the statement itself, they find it “incredible” or “unbelievable.”

            “Incredible” has been debased to mean “unbelievably terrific,” so that has driven people to use “incredulous” incorrectly.

      • As to voting for a third party, you have to be realistic. Game theory shows us that people don’t usually vote for someone they perceive as a non-player, unless a rank preference type of voting system is in place.

    • I get it. And my response is that you must remain vigilant. If you get your social conservatism, you have to keep watching to see what else comes through the door. Like yesterday, when House Republicans voted to gut the Congressional Ethics office — the independent office which was started in 2008 when Abramhoff and others went to prison for corruption.

    • Love it bb.

    • I disagree. Chris Kratzer is addressing Christians, and by and large I don’t hear Christians giving those reasons for why they voted for Trump. Basically all I hear about is 1) SCOTUS, 2) “Hillary is pure evil” & 3) “Globalism is BAD.”

      • ckratzer

        January 5, 2017 at 11:55 am

        Cay, good observation.

      • Yes, Cay, because people cannot defend Trump with Christian ethics, unless they have the ethics of a Westboro Baptist Church member. Remember #4 — anything having to do with Obama. And none of this explains why they chose Trump in the first place — before Hillary was even a factor – when it was nothing a boatload of Republicans. When Trump started spewing his anti-Muslim, anti-Mexican rhetoric, his popularity took off. Why, when they had so many choices?

  5. John King Moore

    January 3, 2017 at 1:37 pm

    Today’s Religious Christian (and I say it that way because there is a huge difference between a religious Christian and a true believer) obviously has no moral guide, is diluted by worldly lusts, is deceived by the very one they deem the enemy and is determined by the lasts of the flesh, mind and eye to follow a wayward spirit that keeps them in a bond age that will lead to personal (and potentially) National destruction.

  6. Ellen Boettcher

    January 3, 2017 at 5:35 pm

    To our selfless Navy Seal who commented earlier. Thank you for your service to this great nation. You are right, our military deserves the best and most just treatment. I deplore all of the situations you wrote about in your comment.
    As I write this, I find myself muting the TV where the latest news is that our Republican congress has just finished a vote to introduce a bill usurping the Congressional Oversite Committee by placing them under Congressional control. No investigation of elected officials will be done without congressional approval. There will be no transparency into who has been accused of illegal acts, because Republicans won’t allow it.
    Paul Ryan gave us a point by point list of changes that will be included in this bill which includes privatizing the VA and Medicare, cutting not only those programs off from any oversight of care. I’ll make a deal with you if you agree. When the VA sends you a voucher to pay for treatment, let me know if you find a good doctor or hospital that will accept it. I’ll do the same for you if, when Medicare sends me vouchers I find a good doctor.
    Donald Trump will no doubt sign off on anything this Republucan Confress passes and that’s one of my problems with him. He lacks the moral character to stand up for or for me. He will stand up for himself and corporate interests. He will continue to embarrass us with his childishness and he will continue to enrich himself at our expense and that of the land we love.
    God Bless you soldier, I understand your anger at how your brothers and sisters in Uniform have been treated. I understand because my brother served in Vietnam and was spit on when came home. But, please understand that Mr Trump will be screwing us as the Republican congress demolishes our laws.

    • I’ve seen the gutting of the Congressional Oversite Committee mentioned a few times and I’m sure by now you know it’s been pulled back thanks to the unpopularity of the move. Who was one of the people to criticize the idea? Trump tweeted, “With all that Congress has to work on, do they really have to make the weakening of the Independent Ethics Watchdog, as unfair as it” and “……..may be, their number one act and priority. Focus on tax reform, healthcare and so many other things of far greater importance! #DTS” Guess you were wrong about Trump on this, Ellen. Is it possible you’re wrong about other things about Trump?

      To keep on point with the post, I’m a right-wing, Bible-thumping, nutjob, Evangelical Christian who is despised and hated by Chris and his readers and I voted for Trump. He was literally my last choice of the Republican candidates and I considered myself a never-Trumper at one time. As time went on and I seriously looked at all of the options, I reluctantly came to the conclusion that of the incredibly sad slate of candidates Trump was the best. Which says a lot about the others running, in my mind. I don’t see the point in rehashing what I saw in him over Hilary, Jill, and Gary. I will say that I think the narrative of him being racist was a crock. I’ve not seen any real evidence. Misogynistic, sure. He has that in common with Hilary. While I may have voted for him that doesn’t mean I think he should get a free pass. He needs to have his feet held to the fire, though I expect I’ll have different issues with his decisions than my liberal, left-wing friends.

      • ckratzer

        January 4, 2017 at 12:45 am

        Shane, thanks for reading and commenting. Wherever you got the impression I “despise and hate” you, I am not sure, and certainly appreciate the opportunity here to clarify that I don’t.

        • I appreciate that, Chris. I read all of your posts and sometimes comment and that’s just the vibe I get. It could just be me. I’d be willing to bet that if we sat down, had some coffee and a conversation we’d agree on a lot more than we disagree.

      • Trump tweeted it was “not a good time”, he did not indicate he didn’t agree with dismantling the Congressional Oversize Committee. He just didn’t want it now, while everyone is watching his and the GOP’s every move. They’ll sneak it through later.

        There was no much misinformation and lies being circulated, for many years, and then repeated until people believed them, that I’m not surprised you felt Trump was your only choice. Let’s just pray our Country survives his Presidency, and not just the wealthy.

        • I agree with your first paragraph, Peggy, and actually your second paragraph, but I apply it to Trump more than Hilary. Even when I was rabidly against Trump I felt people were trumping up (yeah, I did that on purpose) charges against him. I felt then, and still do, Trump has plenty of faults that there was no reason to twist things into what they were not. Right after the election there some videos and articles about how racist, homophobic, misogynistic, xenophobic, and all of the other insults hurled at those who voted for Trump. The only thing it made me do was roll my eyes. If you can’t put up a better candidate than Hilary, you deserve what you get. I looked to Gary Johnson, but I wasn’t impressed with him either.

        • Well we survived barely Obamas fleecing of America….. we will survive a president who takes a dollar a year salary. I am tired of hearing all this crap about Trump being racist and xenophobic etc… those are traditionally democratic symptoms
          Thier mode of operating is to deny and blame others for Thier faults.
          And as far as being Cristian is concerned, this country has been slowly stripped of Jesus,
          And our culture is under threat of being over run by a Muslim mind set.
          This was only reinforced and encouragef by our leader (sic) Obama for the last 8 years.
          It has been the liberals of this country that have brought us to the brink of
          Civil unrest. It may be shocking for them to watch and survive the swamp draining. But they will have to put Thier big pants on and deal with Thier anxieties as we have. Honestly enough is enough.

          • The country never belonged to Jesus. He didn’t come for countries. He came for the hearts and souls of mankind, all of them, all over the world – every race, creed, color and gender. And when you ignore everything He said about what is important in order to support a man like Trump, you are rejecting Jesus as the Lord of your life. When Jesus talks about glory, He’s not talking about earthly things, He’s talking about spiritual. “Make for yourself treasure in HEAVEN.” You can only do that by keep your heart and soul focused on Him. Instead you let your fear and anger turn you toward a Golden Calf… literally, Trump has gold plated his house to ridiculous extremes. As for draining the swamp, as I read from someone recently, pretending to quote Trump, “I’m draining the swamp! I’m going to put in a bigger and better swamp! Deeper, wider, with much bigger alligators! It’s going to be YUGE!” You’re only beginning to cry, “Enough.”

          • Okay first off a country cannot be “stripped of Jesus” since, as Query-ous points out He didn’t come here for the country. Additionally, please oh please explain to me exactly how man can keep Jesus out of anything? I am pretty sure God specifically says no matter what He is with us.

            Also, when does the “swamp draining” start exactly? And what exactly is a “Muslim mind set”?

            I am trying to read these comments with an open mind, but my goodness some of this is just ignorant…

          • I had no intention of responding to anyone but after reading this post I could not help it. I will be as kind as possible. I beg of you Dareesa to read books and to not watch Fox news and even the other channels. Yes democrats at one time were the racists. Democrats shifted their party because of moral changes in their leadership. This happened in the early 60’s to the mid 60’s. This is certainly no myth and maybe you are in your 80’s and do not really know because of the slow transition. Are you aware that over 99% of KKK and white supremacists are republican or “libertarian”? The sad part of your post is you calling our president a Muslim. First of all he clearly is not and second of all you are saying that as if it is an insult. Our government is NOT based on Christianity and we are supposed to be a melting pot of colors and religions. You revealed your true hatred and yes…your racism.

      • I find it intriguing that you say “Look at Trump, he shut it down!”

        When really what he said was “it’s unfair, and it shouldn’t be the first thing we deal with”.

        Because as obnoxious as I find Trump, and as tone-deaf as he can be at times, he’s also good at the soundbite.

  7. Hillary was just worse. Killng unborn babies was the last straw for me.

    • ckratzer

      January 4, 2017 at 12:48 am

      Jay, I hope you will take the time to read an article I recently wrote that challenges the progressive movement and clearly shows that though I may be “progressive,” I certainly understand those who have serious concerns about abortion and join them in that concern. Thanks for taking the time to read and comment on this article! Simply search “Progressive” on the search part of this website and the article will list.

    • Jay,I agree 100%. There’s a difference in saying you are a Christian and truly being a Christian. A true Christian doesn’t pick and choose which commandments he or she will keep. As for abortion…If you can kill one of God’s gifts, you are capable of anything and we were seeing some of that it in Hillary and her crew.

      • ckratzer

        January 4, 2017 at 11:39 am

        Bonny, I find it interesting how many Christians claim to be pro-life while at the same time they are certainly pro-choice about the Bible–determined to protect their freedom to use every interpretive knife they can contrive to abort countless people into hell, murder their souls with condemnation, and yank them out of the womb of God’s Grace, slicing and dicing them with sin-labels and discrimination–all while singing songs to Jesus with a self-righteous smirk on their face.

      • Bonny, what you are actually promoting is a “pro-birth” agenda. What about the rest of that child’s life if they aren’t born into a good, Christian, middle class white family? What about capital punishment? How about support of a militant US government which exports killing on a grand scale overseas?

      • Really? ‘A “true Christian” doesn’t pick and choose which commandments he or she will keep.’? So I have two questions for you…

        Question 1: If a Christian doesn’t get to “pick and choose” then why do you get to support a candidate who chose to break Commandments 7-10 (adultery, stealing, lying, and coveting)? You say they are all important to keep if you are a “true Christian” but the only one you seem to be fighting to protect is number 6 (murder), which some might argue doesn’t even fully apply to your position. So if they are all equal why does Trump get a pass for breaking four of the commandments, possibly even five if you consider that he most obviously worships money, fame, and power as idols, just so long as he supports your position on one?

        Question 2: Do you actually understand what being pro-choice means? Or do you just understand what it means as it has been sold to you by the religious right in this country? Do you understand that being pro-choice does not mean you are pro-abortion?

        You see there is a false narrative that you obviously believe completely, in that being pro-choice in relationship to the topic of abortion means that I want everyone going out and getting abortions all the time. Yes, I am a pro-choice follower of Christ (sorry I don’t use the tainted word Christian anymore). The stance is called pro-CHOICE for a reason. You see when you are pro-CHOICE, as the main alternative candidate in this election was, it means you believe that every individual has the RIGHT TO CHOOSE for themselves. I am pro-CHOICE on a lot of things. I think everyone has the right to choose Pepsi or Coke. I think everyone has the right to choose where they live. I think everyone has the right to choose who they marry. I tink everyone has the right to choose if they believe in God. I think everyone has the right to choose if they go to church or not. I think everyone has the right to choose if they follow Christ. I think everyone has the right to choose if the kill another human being. I think everyone has a God-given right to free will in every instance and every decision point of their lives. I don’t agree with the choice everyone makes, but they have the RIGHT TO CHOOSE.

        I believe people should alway choose Pepsi, that anyone who doesn’t choose to live in Colorado is just insane, that you marry the one you love, that God exists and is my lord and savior, that going to the right church can help my relationship with Christ grow, that Christ is the truth, the light, and the way and that no one gets to God unless they go through Him, and that killing another human being is never an option. But you know what there are people out there who choose Coke, to live in New York, to marry for money, that God is a fairytale (by the way that was me just 12 short years ago), that church is filled with hate, to not follow Christ, and that killing someone else can always be justified. I don’t get to make those decisions for everyone else simply because I disagree with them.

        I also believe that a woman has the right to determine what is best for her, her body, her health AND that of any life that is a part of her’s. Just like you don’t get to legislate that people have to believe that God or that they have to go to church, you don’t get to legislate your morality or your faith in other people’s right to CHOOSE what they do with their body or that of a life that they are responsible for.

        It sucks. But you know what, so does adultery, and divorce, and sex before marriage, and lying, and blasphemy, and cursing, and drinking Coke. But God gave man free will to CHOOSE those courses of action, and you don’t get to be the judge of their moral character because only God knows what is in the heart of a person, and if abortion is wrong he will judge it when the time comes….

    • Hillary was Pro-Choice, not Pro-Abortion. The woman, her husbands and their Doctor makes the choice, not you or anyone else. There are no late term abortions… by choice…only by tragedy. Hillary agreed with a woman’s right to choose. So do I. That does not translate to wanting to kill babies.

    • Yeah, right, J Gee…

      So, according to that perspective the image I get is a maniacal Hillary waiting outside of delivery rooms with a meat cleaver raised above her head ready to chop down on the emerging infant…

      • Great rebuttal Tom. Apparently these people hate Obama so much they will make stuff up that sounds so insane only the most hateful of right wingers will agree.

        • Douglas, on many occasions I much prefer the company of atheist, queers, drag queens, Roman Catholics and Canadians to the company of most American Evangelical “Christians”.

          • Same here. It is nauseating to be judged for not being the same. I swear there is something in the bible about judging others but who knows.

  8. William Bridges

    January 3, 2017 at 11:49 pm

    I want to respectfully point this out. I’m not going to talk about either candidate, but just a thought that I rarely see ever talked about. Jesus and the Jewish nation of that day were slaves to the Roman Empire. Their lives and many things about the way they lived were goverened and dictated by Caesar. Now I point to the Word of God: One time in the scripture Jesus spoke about politics directly, when asked about whether or not to pay taxes, he asked whose face was on the coin and when they answered Caesar, He said render to Ceasar what is Ceasars and to God what is God’s.

    The point is that in all of the Lords discourse he only mentions politics once and it was only when asked a direct question. It seems to me that the true intention of God was to have a people who were I intensely focused on the matters His Kingdom and not the matters of the world. It’s not that things shouldn’t concern Christians, but if it’s a matter of the world like politics, maybe we should simply have faith that God is sovereign and is in control. I’m not saying people shouldn’t vote, vote the way you want to because that’s your right and leave the rest up to God. Maybe it’s just me, but it seems to me like Christians spending so much time involved in the affairs of this life and the country is placed too much emphasis on natural things of this world and not enough on the spiritual things to do with the Kingdom of God. Because if I am giving Him all my heart, strength and mind, seems like I wouldn’t have time for a much else.

    • ckratzer

      January 4, 2017 at 12:50 am

      William, I certainly understand and am familiar with your perspective. I don’t share the same views and ways of applying the biblical realities to which you refer. However, I appreciate your views and are very thankful you took the time to share them.

      • William Bridges

        January 4, 2017 at 2:53 am

        Well If we all had the same opinion things might get a little boring I sincerely hope you find the answer your looking for. The good news is that at the end of the day, God is still sovereign and in control. One day I really believe He will be All in All, regardless of our differences. A man much wiser than I once told me something I find applicable in many discussions, he said “God allows in His wisdom, what He could prevent in His power.” That one statement has helped me in many hard places because it just reminds me that sometimes we just don’t have all the answers and we just have to trust that He has our best interest at heart and that He loves us regardless. Because after all, we may be a mess, but we are His mess

    • William, that was the best response I have read. Yes, we have a right to vote and whether or not our candidate wins, we have to trust in God. God is in control and I just wish I didn’t let people like this Kratzer guy upset me. He is of the world and trying to do God’s job. It can’t be done. Christian or Jew or any other religion cannot change God’s mind, so accept it and welcome our president and give him a chance.

      • William Bridges

        January 4, 2017 at 12:59 pm

        It’s understandable to be upset. The eye affects the heart the Bible’s says. But I find that many times God is not looking at whether or not we had an emotion or thought a thought, etc. He is more concerned with our actions afterward. He is a God of knowledge and by Him actions are weighed. I will respond to someone if I think it’s necessary or maybe even could help them, but I believe God is looking for me to do it from a place of love and not anger. I don’t always win that test, but if I blow it, I just simply repent and get back up and keep walking with Jesus. The point I think that so many people don’t see is that God is always looking at the hearts of His people, the why they do things more than what’s going on around them. Judgment comes first to the house of God the Bible says. I believe God is more concerned with the state of His people’s hearts than the state of the union.

      • Why is it that so many people are happy to apply this mindset (accept the candidate who won) when it is the candidate they support who won, but not if the other candidate won?

        As for being “of the world”, I question whether you have read up anything about Trump, who is practically the textbook definition of a worldly man.

        • We know why Sarah but how dare we speak out against the reasons. Imagine if these people truly spoke out with their true feelings with 100% honesty. Yes they would be pariahs but at least I would respect them more.

    • William, the real Gospel is certainly “political”. Even Mary and Elizabeth in the opening chapter of Luke’s account “get it”.

      Have you every come across the term “Docetic”?

      • William Bridges

        January 4, 2017 at 1:15 pm

        Tom,
        I invite you to give examples, preferably many examples of how you see the gospel as “political”. Not sure what you mean by the “real” gospel. I also do not see what Docetism has to do with the point I was making. I don’t see any real validation for that doctrine through the entirety of scripture, but a doctrine being built on only a few scriptures is not uncommon.

        • William,

          Do you not see something of the political nature of the Good News in Luke 1 ?

          In every letter to churches that we have of Paul’s he addresses the politic of that particular congregation.

          Even “forgiveness” is political;

          “Forgiveness […] is not a psychological matter, or a religious matter, or a “spiritual” matter; it’s a political matter – it’s the centerpiece of the politics of the New Order. Politics is the art of the possible. And the only thing we can possibly do with the impossible natures we foist on each other is drop dead to the business of proving we’re perfect peaches and hand out pardon all around.”

          (Fr. Robert Capon)

          Even when we refer to the Kingdom of Heaven we are making a political statement–one that hopefully indicates our allegiance.

          [Your first comment caused me to think you were being Docetic in your theology.]

          • William Bridges

            January 4, 2017 at 2:04 pm

            Ok, I think I see what your trying to say. The point I was trying to make is that I believe Jesus was trying to set the focus of His people on the things of God and not the things of the world. I wasn’t making inference to the ways in which the word “politics” is used. I simply meant that I see in scripture a principle of God being concerned with changing His people to be more like Him, rather than changing the circumstances in which the people found themselves. He delivers the shoulder from the burden, not the burden from the shoulder. Which is to say He makes the shoulder stronger, (dealing with the person) so that the burden ( natural circumstances) were no longer a burden.

        • If the Gospel is NOT understood to be first of all a political proclamation, then that understanding of the Gospel is incomplete.

  9. “Yet, here we are, the election is over, and Donald Trump is no different—no more presidential, no less arrogant, no less divisive. I could list much more—nothing of him has changed, if anything, it has become worse.”

    Where have you been hiding? The above is just the opposite of what he has been doing. I can see that even from the anti-Trump press.
    There have been plenty of articles written by Christians as to why they support Trump.

  10. Hi Chris, I don’t know if you mean the question rhetorically or not, but you might find the Cracked article by David Wong on the subject of why people voted for Trump interesting. (It’s a serious article, not a joke or parody). Not sure if I can post links here but you can google “How Half Of America Lost Its F**king Mind” Obviously there have been lots of articles on this question but personally I thought this one hit truer to home than most. It’s thought provoking and definitely worth a read.

  11. Sounds like to me you are looking for answers, Please help me understand, over and over again, you may or may not be a Christian, I won’t be the one that makes that decision. Have you asked God to help you understand, and if not why not. If you are a Christian then you will get the answers you need, if not then no explanation to your (help me understand) will be exceptable to you. Like it or not Trump is your next president, now it is up to all Christians to pray for him like we did for Obama.

    • I’m sorry, Trump is the president of those who voted for him. Some of us will never accept, respect or acknowledge him as the President. So… get over it.

  12. Trump represents the anti establishment mindset. While he certainly has his character flaws, he’s not part of the Washington machine. That is what I have heard over & over. Why?
    You really can’t say that the racists, anti gay or right wing nut jobs didn’t push for him. But the turning point was the mid-west where people are tired of the business of government manipulating our lives, pushing cultural agendas and infringing more and more on the US constitution. Well, at least that is what they think. In all honesty the wheels fell off the federal train the day President Obama was sworn in. The Republican leadership agreed to block his every action.
    They complain about how many executive orders he wrote, but they forget to tell you that the congresses since the Republicans took both houses were the least productive ever. They passed nothing and wasted time on things like repetitive hearings on Benghazi while the federal and trade deficit soared. Sure they blame Pres Obama for that too, but want you to forget Congress controls the purse
    strings.
    Trump is just a product of anger with
    this stagnation in government. He said he and he alone can change things. I certainly wish him well because if he goes down we all go down.
    Oh, and on the Christian vote thing, he is “currently” anti-abortion and that is enough for most Evangelicals.

    • ckratzer

      January 4, 2017 at 11:41 am

      Ken, I appreciate your comments and the time you have given to share them. In my opinion, the abortion excuse, though certainly an important issue a cowardly copout. I find it interesting how many Christians claim to be pro-life while at the same time they are certainly pro-choice about the Bible–determined to protect their freedom to use every interpretive knife they can contrive to abort countless people into hell, murder their souls with condemnation, and yank them out of the womb of God’s Grace, slicing and dicing them with sin-labels and discrimination.

  13. I’ve been reading comments from Christians about this and the answer finally dawned on me. Christianity is this gigantic swirling dust cloud of all kinds of beliefs backed by scripture. You choose and see what you want to. It’s like trying to make sense of a dust cloud. You can’t. There will never be a consistent logical answer to this question.

  14. Kimbrough Leslie

    January 4, 2017 at 6:53 am

    “Donald Trump is my president by nature of my proud citizenship and civic respect, and will receive my prayers, love, and best wishes.” No, not for me. My citizenship is in the reign of God alone. My loyalty will never be to any president. And this one deserves no more than the radical love and the “common courtesy” Martin Luther King, Jr. said is due any enemy, not one bit of respect unless and until he were to earn it, unlikely as that is.

  15. Please help me understand why we shouldn’t? Donald Trump hasn’t even done anything yet for us to criticize him. He won’t be in office until the 20th.

    • His behaviour throughout his campaign, including his comments about women and minorities, was appalling. He recently tweeted about his plans to increase America’s nuclear arsenal. He has repeatedly behaved like a spoiled child on Twitter.

      Yes, he’s earned my criticism. No, he has not behaved in a presidential manner.

      If he turns out to be a better president than his behaviour so far has suggested, then I for one will be delighted. Trump’s worst behaviour played out as the most powerful man in the world is a nightmare, and I will rejoice if he grows up. I’m not interested in being proven right at the expense of sanity and security in the world in which I live.

      But to suggest this man has not done anything worthy of criticism is nonsense.

    • I cannot even imagine Aaron what the response would be to president Obama is he was in bed with Putin. Now yes you can deny the facts about the Russian hacking and deny all the praise trump has given to Putin but that does not mean it is not fact. Isn’t it amazing that a man went all the way to a pizza place to kill others to save children from a fake story? Facts matter so very little to so many. It’s bloody sad.

  16. I am a Christian pastor in the south. I did not support the president-elect. But I will try to answer as how I think the average person o the street down here, who strong supported the president-elect, would answer.

    I think most wholeheartedly believe Hillary Clinton is more corrupt, culpable for military contractors dying in Benghazi, and in bed with an international finance system that harms our country. I think they would say that Clinton would help many more babies be aborted, and that she would open the doors of our borders to immigrants including, unintentionally, terrorists, and be soft on crime. They also would say that lots of people are on welfare and getting free health care and that is not fair. They believe the government helps make people lazy.

    Now, whether these are valid complaints is a whole other matter but that is why the average person I run into (at least in the south) voted for Trump without blinking. These same people would maintain they are Christian, that we should be forgiving (in regard to Trump), and the whole problem is that we are allowing Muslims, atheists, and self centered celebrities to influence us instead of Jesus. They wouldn’t dig much deeper than that.

    Again, these are not my positions. I am not defending the positions. But that is what I believe they would say to you if you asked them.

    I appreciated your essay.

    • ckratzer

      January 4, 2017 at 2:56 pm

      Tom, first, thanks for reading and commenting on my blog and investing the time and courage to do so. Second, your reflections communicate much wisdom, perspective, and insight and were communicated very well. I so appreciate the thoughtful and articulate response and for your contribution to this conversation.

      • I wish I could edit the poor grammar in my first paragraph. It is what happens to me when I start typing and the phone rings, I talk, and then pick back up what I was writing. 🙂

        I have subscribed to your blog and look forward to future posts.

        All the best,

        Tom

  17. Chris – many Christians also supported Hillary. To be fair, will you be writing an article extolling the virtues of Hillary? Please don’t leave out any of the facts if you do.

    • I am going to assume you think she is a criminal so why not list your facts about Hillary. Also do you find it odd that the “investigations” have ended now that the election has ended?

  18. Marvin mitchell

    January 5, 2017 at 4:15 am

    They can’t make you understand and for those who think they could they should be internally ashamed because their actions are a direct conflict to their supposed indoctrination. They’ve sold their souls to the Devil in a manner of speaking and it was done selfishly for worldly gains of the flesh. That’s what their so called Christianity is supposed to help them transcend.

  19. God’s plan. What do we know of His plan? We read in the Scriptures that He is a God of Justice, a God to be feared, a Jealous God. God created the Universe, which includes sin, temptation, the devil, and set humans up for failure from the very beginning. We are taught that mankind fell from God’s good grace when Eve chose to eat the fruit from the forbidden Tree of Knowledge. God created the tree and fruit, He placed it near His people, and He even provided a talking serpent with the sole purpose of tempting, advising, and misleading Eve – it was His will the entire time. We are fed that God gave us choice – but did He? How would Eve know it was unwise and immoral for her to disobey God. You can shout at an infant not to fall down 2 flights of stairs, and the infant will choose, but even though you tell the baby it is unwise and wrong to tumble down the stairs, that she will get hurt, the baby still has to make a choice. The baby doesn’t know it is unwise to ignore the parent. The baby doesn’t know she will get hurt falling down the stairs, even after you just told her. The baby has an even harder time choosing right from wrong when the parent puts the baby’s favorite toy a few steps below, and one of the infant’s siblings coaxes the baby to come and get it, all will be fine, Dad will never find out anyway. Can the baby really make the right choice here? She doesn’t know right from wrong, she doesn’t know ignoring the parents is a bad thing, she doesn’t know about danger and pain. So dad set this up for the baby to take the fall. God did the same with Eve, and then with Adam – they were innocent and without the fruit of knowledge had no way of knowing it was wrong to ignore God. What does this have to do with trump?

    America was presented with a choice, without the wisdom to know which way to vote. Hillary has a lot of experience as a Statesman, but with that comes plenty of corruption. trump has no experience as a Statesman, and presents himself as having no corruption – that he is too rich to be corrupted. Half of America was angry that the 1950s were gone, many weren’t even born yet. They missed the trimmed grass of the front lawn, the white picket fence, the suburban house on streets teeming with children, all playing together. And the kids were disciplined – because they were beaten into submission, and no laws protected them. Everyone had jobs, and made enough to support their family, even having enough to take annual vacations to Disneyland, the Grand Canyon, and to DC.
    But America isn’t like that today. The lawns that are green and trimmed belong to million dollar homes. The white picket fences are all gray and fallen over, and new fences 10 feet high with a 24 hour guard has replaced them. All of this splendor goes to men and women who get out of bed mid-morning, have a nice commute to work, look at programs about other people’s money and whether they make a mistake or not they aren’t going to be held accountable – it is so institutionalized that they can break serious federal laws and no one will go to jail, they don’t even have to admit wrongdoing. The fine is for millions of dollars which they will make up in 2 days, if that, and they go home with a multi-million dollar bonus. It isn’t like that for most Americans either – especially the ones who voted for trump. Their yard is so overgrown it hides broken down cars and old living room furniture is now “lawn furniture.” They live in a trailer or “modular” home, or in a lesser version of the McMansions. They wake up hours before the sun, fight traffic or worse, sexual advances on the over cramped public subways. Their farms are no longer making them enough money to live off of, and farms that have been in the family for generations are foreclosed on by that same rich man in a nice air conditioned office, who sells the farm to a corporation. What really hurts Americans is when corporations like Monsanto sue them for every penny they own because their crop got infiltrated by the gmo crop which is trademarked…so if they weren’t broke before, they are now. And that family would shout out at the government to do something, except the corporations pay so much money to the politicians they were able to have the government declare their business was a person with the same Rights as the farmer, and billions and billions of dollars to pay politicians, with tax deductible donations in the form of secret PACs, which might as well be PACTS. Parents in their 40s and 50s are working 2 or more entry level unskilled working jobs because they cannot get a job to pay them enough to feed their family. Their public education was a disgrace, they were merely taught how to memorize answers for an annual test, no actual education or critical thinking existed. They had no chance at college because they were too poor to get a loan. The poor are the ones needing the loan the most. And America hates the poor – they will let a rich person who has more money than they know what to do with lease a different car every year at the lowest possible interest rate and super low prices – with cash back incentives; meanwhile that parent working 2 jobs gets the highest legal interest rate for an almost broken down buy as-is car which she has no choice but to buy because the poor side of the suburbs are too far away for her to walk, and the rich politicians were pressured by the rich bankers to get rid of the bus routes in those neighborhoods because there was no profit in it.

    No profit. No prophet. Hershey’s opened their factory in America, they paved the roads, built the parks, stadium, high school, ball parks, houses, public pool, community center, clinic, and commissary to make sure their new employees had everything they needed. They made sure no one was overworked, that no job was left unfilled because of lack of profit, they spent money on safety instead of injury lawsuits. Today companies look themselves up and down to see what they can cut to add a few more dollars to their pocket. Why they get rid of jobs and the people working them when they are already disgustingly rich is a mystery to most, the only explanation is greed. First houses go, then community centers, and pools, and parks, and everything – the companies have no business and no profit providing anything for their workers. They do keep money in ball parks and stadiums though, there is a huge profit in that.

    So somebody who make more in 24 hours than most Americans make all month, sometimes all year, cut jobs. They don’t see the foreclosures, the repossessions, the sullen faces of a 45 year old and his family moving into their parents basement. They don’t see how expensive milk has gotten, they have no idea what vegetables cost, they just know they will only eat the best all organic food – and wonder why America is so obese and why do they keep eating frozen burritos, ramen, and mac & cheese. The rich people that are making decisions that affect our daily lives in the most negative ways have no idea what they are doing to the people. At least we hope they have no idea.

    So the rich corporations that are now people present America with 2 choices. One is a career politician with experience – the status quo – incase America isn’t ready for change. The other has no experience at all, is not a politician, and is so far from the status quo it is insane – just incase Americans are in need of change. Then these two are put into a cockfight to kill each other, even though they have been good friends for decades. America is bombarded with messages – this one is evil, that one is evil, you can’t trust this one, this one is corrupt.

    Then something truly insane happens. Americans who have lost or are in danger of losing their jobs overseas so rich people can get richer, see how things are for them today and they hate it. Some hate living in their parents basement, others want their farm back, and almost all of them want the suburban life with 2 cars, a pet, and annual vacation, and weekends – not to mention insurance and medical. And since they don’t have that today – it HAS to be the current parties fault. So they look to a rich man, who only wants to get richer, and asks him to save them from poverty.

    This man is an echo of America, a mirror that changes depending on who is looking at him. Angry farmers are against abortion – he is against abortion. Angry families in basements are against Mexicans taking their jobs, so he is against Mexicans. Angry Christians are pissed off that they don’t have a complete theocracy over America and it must be the Muslims fault – so he is against Muslims.

    He cannot give answers on policies, or how he plans on fixing things, because he has no idea. And in rich person fashion, instead of asking experts to help him fix the nation, he hires other rich people with no expertise in politics and no idea what they are doing either…..they all just know this is the single greatest opportunity to make them the richest people on Earth. Damned be the poor.

    And he echoed that hate, the racism and bigotry, the anger, and Americans looked at all of his hate and thought to themselves that he was just like them, because they are also filled with so much anger and hate, so he must be the obvious choice. And they cannot answer why they support him, they can only say he isn’t Clinton. She is this, she is that, blah blah blah. Not “my candidate will raise the tariff on all countries that employ workers with less benefits and pay than America” or some other plan to save the nation – they can’t because he won’t tell them. He is crooked, disgusting, stupid – he insults women, anyone different, anyone that criticizes him, he fits the fascist mold of a tyrant – but he is so angry at all the same things the average Americans are angry at.

    That is how they ignore his pussygrabbing. They say “nobody is perfect” or “it was just locker room banter, we all do it and you know it”. I don’t know what gyms they go to, or who their mother is, but I know that even in private I would never say the things he says, or think the things he thinks, my mother would be ashamed, and there is no defense. But they defend him still, because he is angry and they are angry – so they tell us to get over it. They tell us that Obama made all the problems, he isn’t even American and he is a Muslim. Even though trump said he could walk out in the middle of the street and shoot somebody he would still get elected and everyone would still love him – and it baffles anyone with any intelligence, but 18% of America voted for him – in all the right places, with Russia’s help. He illegally gained the presidency, and the minority of voters love him all the more for it.

    So I ramble on and on, for the simple point of shared anger. Americans should be angry, our companies should stay and keep us employed instead of looking for a profit. And America has lost the ability to change companies because life is too expensive for them to Unionize and picket or shut down companies – and Americas unemployed need jobs so badly that companies can crap all over their employees knowing they will stay because there are thousands to fill every position, and they can keep paying less and less. And those companies took over the presidency, and the legislatures, and they will get rid of America’s safety nets. No food stamps, no welfare, no HUD, no disability, no insurance, no medical – because in the end Americans will have no choice but to become slaves. You can’t complain, you can’t quit, and if you walk out, there is no safety net to save you from ruin. If you get injured, there is no safety net to keep you from ruin. If you get sick, there is no medical to save your life. These rich people believe that if you work hard, you will get paid lots of money, and you will be successful. They believe that if you are working 3 jobs, you must be lazy because you can’t make enough in one job to support your family. They believe if you work hard and “earn your way” that you will have a multi-million dollar retirement, and if you don’t, it is completely your fault. They did it, why can’t you. The fact they inherited wealth, education, employment, and position means nothing – they worked as an intern on Wall Street for a whole year – they earned their way up the chain. If you can’t do that, then you must be a lazy bum. And America hates the poor.

    trump is angry at the poor, calling them lazy. X-farmers and basement dwellers are also angry at the poor, because they are lazy and getting free hand outs – hand outs they don’t qualify for yet, so they blame the poor for emptying America’s treasury and putting us in debt. So they are all angry at the poor, so trump has to be the right choice.

    As ordained by God. Jesus was clothed in linen and buried in a rich mans tomb – he wasn’t poor, he just pitied the poor, and offered them a way into heaven. Good people, good Christians, would simply have more of everything if it weren’t for the poor.

    Or Mexicans.

    Or Immigrants.

    Or Refugees.

    Or Terrorists.

    Or Muslims.

    Or Women.

    Or Unions.

    Or Clinton.

    A vision of shared anger that was echoed by trump is exactly how he got elected, and it is why they will forgive him for anything. Everyone, even the most pious, have angry thoughts about someone or something. Everyone has done something to be condemned for – and if not, God set this whole thing up so that they are sinners from birth. So nobody is perfect – which is why they forgive trump for what he says and does.

    Eve ate the fruit because God forced her to. America elected satan because God let angry hearts rule.

    • ckratzer

      January 5, 2017 at 11:48 am

      Archegos, now that’s a comment! 🙂 Thanks for reading and sharing!

    • You are brilliant and have described the America we live in. As a Christian, bleeding-heart progressive liberal, I applaud you.

      I believe that this man the minority of the country has voted to be the next president is evil. Time will show us.

    • Hopefulllessness

      January 5, 2017 at 3:15 pm

      Wow! Bravo! (And I am not being sarcastic…you have tapped into my anger and how I view all politicians right now.) Thank you for ranting for me.

    • What is sad is how much truth there is in this comment :'(

    • Yes, Archegos, the system is rigged.

      What continues to puzzle me is that there were two candidates in the later part of the primaries who, though in opposite parties, were “Populist” candidates–Sanders and Trump. Why the hell didn’t “Christians” notice the honesty and desire to fight for the little guys and gals that Bernie has exhibited his entire time in politics?? Totally puzzling….

  20. I live in the most liberal state in the country and also have a difficult time understanding how Christians voted for Trump. I do, however live near a military base and talk to more conservative folks. (I no longer consider myself a Christian)

    As a former devout Christian, I noticed a sense of fear and blind adherence to the propaganda spouted by the “news” that was acceptable to Christians. They spun up false narratives about all the candidates that had very little to do with the truth. Underlying there seemed to be fear that voting for one candidate was evil without objectively looking at both. Those who saw the hypocrisy of it all wanted neither and voted for Trump just to burn the establishment down.

    It is frightening and crazy, but I think that maybe this collective movement will, indeed, be a big change. However, it will be the pendulum swinging so far towards the oligarchy that there will be a breakdown of systems and collapse of the world as we know it. Now, maybe that is God’s plan, but before there is paradise, there has to be a big fall. Trump is going to get us there sooner than later.

  21. She is a liar (proven many times over). She supports abortion and is therefore pro-choice. She let four men die in Benghazi. The list goes on and on. How can you support her?

    • ckratzer

      January 5, 2017 at 1:03 pm

      Michelle, the article has nothing to do with Hillary. And sadly, in my opinion, many are using her as a way of deflecting from dealing with the issues of this article

    • Did you support Bush after thousands died on 9/11?

      Did you support him when he continued to ally himself with Saudi Arabia, where the extremism was born that led to 9/11?

      Do you realise that people died in embassies and similar tragedies during Bush’s reign?

      Further back, did you support Reagan when he made deals with corrupt countries and regimes? Iran-Contra, anyone?

      Have you seen Donald Trump’s warmongering tweets? His desire to support nuclear proliferation when we already have enough nuclear weapons in the world to obliterate it several times over? Is it pro-life to desire war? To challenge one’s enemies to an arms race?

      Is it pro-life to be concerned about making sure babies get born, but then not supporting them with childcare and with good schools and with decent jobs?

      Truly, there is a double standard at work here. It is as plain as the nose on one’s face. As long as one carries the standard of pro-birth and “conservative values”, one will be forgiven much by right-wing America 🙁

    • Really? The list goes on and on? Please do go on…

      In response, first off pro-choice is not pro-abortion, and people that think that are ignorant and close minded. Being pro-choice means you support a woman’s right to choose based on her own beliefs. That means that as someone who is a pro-choice Christian I support your right not to have an abortion, as equally as I support another woman’s right to make a different choice that is best for her. Does that make me pro-life? No, it means that I support what the individual believes is best for themselves, not what is best for me. The rhetoric you have bought into by the religion right says that if you are pro-choice that you have to automatically think everyone should have an abortion. Get over yourself. There are 7.4 billion people in the world. Only about 2.2 billion of them are Christian (of whatever flavor). There is NOTHING in the bible that says you or I as a Christian have the right to tell the other 5.2 billion people how to think or act or make decisions. In fact, it says just the opposite. It says we are to “plant the seeds” and God will change their hearts. You don’t save anyone, and you do not have the right to make a law of your faith. IF you are so hung up on the sin of abortion, why aren’t you out there supporting a law making it illegal to get a divorce? Or to commit one of the sins that God calls blasphemy unforgivable, so why are you not fighting for a Supreme Court that makes that punishable by death? Or to commit adultery? Or to curse your parents? What about your sin? What if I was fighting for a law to make you a criminal because of your sin, would you be in favor of that? I doubt it…

      As for lying… That was your measuring stick? Was that the first criteria you used to decide who you should vote for? It was the first criteria you used in your argument. Because if it was your defining criteria for your choice you FAILED miserably. You see there are these things called facts. Facts define what is and is not a lie. If you say something or make a statement that is in opposition of facts that is a lie. The candidate that you appear to have supported has been found by almost every credible source in our country to lie about 20-37 times per day when he is in public. He lies approximately 84% of the time. So if lying is your measuring stick please, as the author of this article has asked, explain to me how you can support Trump given his lying?

      I am not going to go down the Benghazi rabbit hole with you because it is stupid and been proven to be a complete and total falsehood. The fact that you even included it in your comment says everything there is to say about you.

      Finally, you ask a question of “How can you support her?” How is this relevant to the conversation? There is nothing in this incredibly well-written article about supporting “Her”. This continued deflection by Trump supporters away from his flaws and sins and corruption to “her” is idiotic. At some point you need to own your choices and be held accountable for them as a choice you made of free will. There was no lesser of two evils argument to be made, that entire stance is a false equivalency created to make people like you feel good about choosing someone that so clearly goes against everything you claim to believe in. So stop trying to deflect away from your choice and answer the author’s question….

  22. These are, in essence, the same questions I have been asking my church family. My stock reply to “Well, Trump is the lesser of two evils” has been to point out that even the least evil option is still evil. The second way Trump is justified among my christian friends is that he is an instrument for God’s will to be done. The way I understand it, all I am able to know of God’s will, is that He loves us, and desires for us to to be saved. I can speculate all day long about what God’s plan is for america through Trump, but in the end, I view my job as a christian is to choose against evil whenever I encounter it, in whatever form it takes. If this is truly God’s will,it will come to pass with or without my support.

  23. Mr. Kratzer,
    First off thank you for your article.

    I have been struggling with this issue since the President-elect became the GOP candidate by carrying much of the “Christian” vote in the Republican party, including many high profile leaders of this “religion”. I have struggled with so much so that I have questioned my connection to the “Christian” “religion”. I don’t question my relationship with God, but rather whether the existing church is the best place for that relationship to be fostered. If it is filled with people who will vote for a morally bankrupt person simply because they speak in favor of ONE topic I can’t, as you put it, understand that.

    I have read over and over again, both in other articles and in the above responses to this post, that “Christians” voted for Trump because of his stance on abortion. Really? His sin is irrelevant to your decision-making process of who should be the leader of our “one nation under God”? So you are willing to overlook the laundry list of his sins and complete and total lack of character in hopes the Supreme Court will be adjusted in such a way that they will make a moral judgment against the law? Your idea of leading the way of Christ is to pass a law enforcing your belief on those who don’t believe as you do? There was another group in the bible that chose that as a course of action, they were called the Pharisees…

    What I have come to realize is the “religion” I am connected to by the word “Christian” no longer has any understanding what it means to be Christ-like. They have become exactly what Christ stood against. It is SAD to read the comments from these people, and yet at the same time it continues to clearly define for me the fact that I am on a path to being more Christ-like more so than I am on a path to be more “Christian”. I think we need to find a new word for what we are…

    • I agree with you Andy, except that we don’t need a new word for Christian just because there are those, many of those, that are blinded by their narrow views. “Christianity” is a very broad term encompassing so many different beliefs, but will always mean to believe in Christ Jesus as our savior. Changing the title is no different than Neo-nazi being called Alt-right. I am a Christian and we must share this “truth” with all that are blinded. Thanks

      • Aaron,
        I know that to be true… I just continue to be disappointed by the negative connotation that “Christian” and “Christianity” currently carries because of the perceptions. It is one thing to be persecuted because what you believe in challenges others to think differently. It is entirely different to be persecuted because you are associated with the negativity of a title. These negative perceptions become reality for many. When you start any conversation with a non-believer and use the title of “Christian” there is a 50/50 chance you have lost their attention. I can’t tell you how tired I am of hearing people I know or that I talk to tell me “you are different than other Christians I know”. That is sad… And yet I am hopeful that means I get to plant the seed. God bless!

      • Aaron, I’m convinced that nomenclature that has worse connotations than “Christian” (which is my last name, btw…sometimes I’m the only Christian at church ;o) ) is “Evangelical”. That old, good and once meaningful term presently in the eyes of many has come to mean the opposite of what it once signified. “Evangelical” is presently irredeemable. Evangelicals have struck a deal/transaction with a god who looks more like Moloch than Jesus.

  24. What about separation of church and state…

  25. So…tell me how electing Hillary would have been any different in the results for the general public based on the known facts of herclying to the American public.

  26. Patronizing? Condescending? Waaaaay over-generalizing? I’m trying to figure out the best way to describe your comments.

  27. IMHO, perhaps the most “Christian” vote, especially by Evangelicals, would have been the rejection of both Democratic and the Republican candidates and then to vote 3rd party.

  28. Congratulations. Nice Piece! We posted it on The Christian Left.

    It garnered 2K likes was shared 894 times reaching 123,226 people.

    Something to be proud of! Nice work!

    • ckratzer

      January 5, 2017 at 7:27 pm

      Charles, thank you so much for the share, so honored! Let me know any way I can serve you and your organization. Thank you for your work!

  29. I’ll explain. 1st- The majority of the facts you report about Mr. Trump are false. In other words, Fake News. 2nd– Any and all of Mr. Trump’s former or future sins were forgiven at the cross. Pretty simple. Now move on.

  30. I respectfully suggest that you read and listen to Franklin Graham’s interviews on Fox news and follow him oFacebook, I agree with what he ha said about the election, hopefully some of your questions will be answered Carol B. Willis

    • Yeah, right. Franklin Graham is to be regarded as Christ follower?? The only reason he’s even paid attention to is because of his patrimony. I pity Billy for having a hateful son in Franklin.

      How about I “respectfully suggest” that you read and listen to someone like Frankie Schaeffer…you might actually learn something.

  31. Can a Democrat be a Christian? Yes!
    Should they be? No. The Democratic party won’t endorse a candidate who’s against planned parenthood.
    The Democratic party supports and endorses planned parenthood abortion clinics, gives the thumbs up to partial birth abortion up to the final 9th month, created a market for body parts and voted against protection of babies that survive an partial birth abortion.

    Democrats are against the teaching of the Bible by saying the bible is wrong and marriage is not between a man and a women, but rather endorses the union between the same sex as holy matrimony.

    Democratic party took away God’s position on born gender and believes gender is a human choice, which allowed their leader to pass an executive order to allow transgender men into womens public restrooms.
    If you call yourself a Christian and a Democrat your living in a lie.
    And people wonder how Trump got the evangelical vote.
    No mystery here.

    • John P, if you critically examine the history of the Republican party since Richard Nixon, but especially beginning with Reagan, you will note that the Grand Old Party has PROMISED to repeal RvW or pass an anti-abortion amendment in every election cycle. There has never been a serious attempt to keep that promise. NEVER. Why not? Because the majority of the party is pro-choice. Evangelicals have been PLAYED and lied to on this single issue for at least 40 years.

      I would assert that the Republican party is just as pro-abortion as what you say the Democrats are–they are just not as honest about it. Wake up and smell the coffee!

      Again, for the life of me, why don’t “Christians” who think they should vote not vote 3rd/independent party?

      [Possible answer; because they fear loosing what little political power they have left. IT’S ALL ABOUT THE POWR, BABY!!]

      • BtW, as an 18 yr old I voted for Nixon, then Ford, then Reagan 2x, then Bush 1 who was the last Republican liar candidate I’ve voted for since.

        Republicans and Democrats are playing the same old game. Christians should think about moving their votes to another game entirely.

  32. Monica Connolly

    January 5, 2017 at 9:15 pm

    In politics, as in personal relationships, people latch on to one or two things they like in a person, and believe the rest of their character matches, despite proof to the contrary, America has been scared since 9/11, and Trump pandered to the fear of Muslims; there has been a near-depression, and Trump says America will be great again, and jobs shipped overseas will come back. He’s anti-abortion. People like this, and discount the rest.
    Furthermore, there were an incredible number of lies about Hilary Clinton, and people tend to feel where there’s smoke there’s fire.

  33. So holding a LGBT flag at a rally makes him homophobic? Wanting to keep out ILLEGAL immigrants is racist? Wanting to vet Muslim refugees with ties to terrorist nations and organizations is xenophobic? Clinton is as close as you can get to the antichrist without actually being the antichrist. That’s why Trump gets my support.

  34. Nobody has ever said Trump is a perfect Christian. As a Christian I voted for him because his platform was much closer to my values than Hillary’s. One example being Pro Life. He also is appointing more conservative judges to the Supreme Court than Hillary would.

    • ckratzer

      January 5, 2017 at 10:51 pm

      Paul, thanks for your comments. In my opinion, the abortion excuse, though certainly an important issue a cowardly copout. I find it interesting how many Christians claim to be pro-life while at the same time they are certainly pro-choice about the Bible–determined to protect their freedom to use every interpretive knife they can contrive to abort countless people into hell, murder their souls with condemnation, and yank them out of the womb of God’s Grace, slicing and dicing them with sin-labels and discrimination.

  35. Of the two options given us, he was the better choice. At least we know exactly where we stand and who we truly have as a leader. Unlike Hilary who lied, stole, cheated, embezzled, had hidden agends, murdered, and so on. The 10 commandment were seriously broken on a massive extent. This makes Donald the lesser if two evils with some promises that i for onnowbe look forward to seeing happen. Thigs like a wall on Mexico boarder. This will save Trillions of dollars for us to spend in many areas we need.

    • ckratzer

      January 5, 2017 at 10:47 pm

      Susie, this article is not about Trump verses Hillary or any other candidate.

    • MidwestBeliever

      January 6, 2017 at 5:14 pm

      Let’s all reconvene in 4 years and see if there’s a wall, if there’s less government spending, if there’s a “better America”. My bets are that The Donald and his rich cronies will get richer and the rest of us will get poorer. He’s certainly setting up his cabinet to do just that.

  36. Well said! I too have been baffled that many who claim to be faithful Christians have tried to justify Trump’s extensive record of vile language and behavior and his views which contradict everything Jesus taught and exemplified and some even pretend that it was God’s will to have such a reprobate to lead our nation.

  37. It’s called, better than the alternatives. Period. I don’t know who you listen to, but I personally don’t know anyone who voted for him because he was godly or Christian or morally pure. We didn’t have a candidate like that to choose from. I am pretty sure there has never been an American President who could have passed muster as a godly man with everyone. As someone else said, we weren’t electing him to be pope.

  38. I could clearly explain it to you fully and accurately and I assure I’m right. but it would take you contacting me as it would take a bit for me to explain. if you’re interested text me.
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  39. Not sure anyone thought he was the best candidate for the position but I do believe he was the best of the two we were left with.
    As for your questions concerning Christianity.. people make mistakes. I’m sure you have, I know I have and no doubts, Donald Trump certainly has. Our faith is based on a God who offers forgiveness of sins. He sent us his only begotten son to be, among other things, an example of how we are to forgive others. I believe Donald Trump has been humbled during this election process and realized the error of his past sins. Who are you, we, to say that he has not cried out to God for forgiveness? Time will tell.

  40. What would you say if Hillary got elective ? He’ll mary??????

  41. I read this article a month or two back. Scot McKnight references it in a recent blog post–which is good and I recommend it, and I’ll paste the link below.

    This from someone in England who is seeing the need to expand the party’s borders: Michael Sandel at The Guardian;

    The election of Donald Trump and the triumph of Brexit – the two political earthquakes of 2016 – resulted from the failure of elites to grasp the discontent in democracies around the world. The populist revolt marked the rejection of a technocratic approach to politics incapable of understanding the resentments of voters who feel the economy and the culture have left them behind.

    Some denounce populism as little more than a racist, xenophobic reaction against immigrants and multiculturalism. Others view it as a protest against the job losses brought about by global trade and new technologies. But to see only the bigotry in populist protest, or to view that protest only in economic terms, misses the fact that the upheavals of 2016 stemmed from the establishment’s inability to address – or even adequately recognise – genuine grievances.

    The populism ascendant today is a rebellion against establishment parties generally, but centre-left parties have suffered the greatest casualties. This is mainly their own fault. In the US, the Democratic party has embraced a technocratic liberalism more congenial to the professional classes than to the blue-collar and middle-class voters who once constituted its base. A similar predicament faces the Labour party.

    Before they can hope to win back public support, progressive parties must rethink their mission and purpose. To do so, they should learn from the populist protest that has displaced them, not by emulating its xenophobia and strident nationalism, but by taking seriously the legitimate grievances with which these sentiments are entangled. And that means recognising that the grievances are about social esteem, not just wages and jobs.

    • Rebecca Stuckey

      January 6, 2017 at 1:28 pm

      I am a Christian, I’m ‘middle aged,’ I live in a rural red state, and our family has been asking this question since Donald Trump first began talking and tweeting in the primary season. It is bewildering that Christians with ‘one issue’ on their minds can overlook the multitude of offensive behaviors and language that spill out of him with regularity. We have wrestled with your question…. my opinion: I think it was a ‘perfect storm’ scenario – uninformed voters, a candidate that said anything regardless of truth or fact, fake news and hackers spewing outrageous lies about HRC, and a desire for our government to be less bureaucratic and less broken. And for some crazy reason, people were attracted to his verbage. Come to think of it, I’m sorry, Chris, there is no understanding. Our entire family, 3 grown children, including one military officer, and my extended family all Christians – all supported HRC and cannot understand why any Christian, woman, person of color, Latino, and other minority could support him.

      • ckratzer

        January 6, 2017 at 1:32 pm

        Rebecca, thanks for your comment and readership, so appreciate your time and energy to add to this conversation. Your comment is thoughtful and very well said.

  42. With all due respect, your political statement falls on deaf ears with me. If the questions were really questions, and not political/moral judgments, then you would moderate the responses to that end. I don’t expect you will agree with me (publically anyway); but your whole essay was not a search for answers. It was a diatribe of judgement. Shame on you.

    And this comes from a person who did not vote for Trump for my own ethical reasons. But, Kudos for achieving your goals–that of shaming those, and encouraging the demeaning of, those, who supported and voted for a candidate that you do not support. Do you truly feel better? What is the spirit in you saying?

    God bless.

    • ckratzer

      January 6, 2017 at 8:18 pm

      Robert, thanks for reading and commenting. For all that you say this article has fallen on “deaf ears” for you, it seems you are doing a good bit of deflecting and gymnastics to avoid the issues that are raised by it.

      • Let me respectfully ask a question Chris–and I mean this with agape love–do you really want to have answers to those questions you raise, which are valid btw? Or, are you more interested in scoring political points, whip up a corner to place people into, and place your judgement above others? You didn’t lose me with the article per se–you lost me with the pontification and moderation of the comments.

        Let me put it this way, have you ever successfully moderated between two aggrieved parties? Maybe even witnessed to a Muslim, or a Buddhist, or an Aetheist. or similar? In my experience, one is much more successful–no, make that more impactful, if one does so with humility and love and with understanding. I suggest your moderation lacks that

        I could not personally pull the lever for either Trump or Clinton. I kept the quote of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn near and dear to my heart the whole time when trying to make that draconian choice we were all asked to make, “Let the lie come into the world, let it even triumph. But not through me”. You see, As a guy in the middle, I can objectively make an even more damning scriptural indictment of the Clintons. What would that prove? Only to whip up anger from the opposite side and attaboys from the other.

        How does your article work to heal or create understanding? I may not have voted for Trump, for many of the reasons put forth; but, I am still absolutely convinced that Hillary suffers from just as much, or more, scriptural baggage. She just hid things better.

        There can only be two possible goals that I see with the thrust of your article (enlighten if I’ve missed something) 1. To provide questions as a framework to get others to think them through 2. To place yourself in a position of power and righteousness and cast judgement on others. I suggest, if you read the flow of the comments, that the Spirit will whisper the answer in your ear. You can divine what/who whispered in my ear to get me to take the time to comment at all.

        Peace.

        • ckratzer

          January 7, 2017 at 1:32 pm

          Robert, I appreciate our further dialogue, but with all due respect, it seems the more you write, the more you prove my point. In my opinion, you sound much like the religious who criticized Jesus’ rants with much the same talking points as yours, though this article was certainly no rant, but obviously effective at raising questions and holding up a mirror to those willing to look and dialogue about the real issues. Additionally, I know one thing for sure, I have people in my life whom God uses as a mouthpiece into my life, and God has never used a person to speak into my life that declares or insists that they are being used by God to be a voice in my life. Pro Tip: In my experience of those that aspire to be religious, cocky jerks determined to deflect the issues, misunderstand, and stir up circle arguments, you could take your game to the next level wth a few simple adjustments… 1) use a lot of more scripture quoting and proof-texting 2) just go all the way and say “God told me to tell you” 3) be even more arrogant in attitude. You are doing well, for sure, but these simple tips could help you to be well on the way to pretentious beast-mode.

        • Pretentious to say the least Robert.

          When I read stuff such as you just wrote to Chris what I see is someone speaking to their own insecurities and doubts.

          I think Chris’ goal is what you cited under #1. The way in which Chris has dialogued with commenters and moderated has proven that to be true. Apparently, you didn’t have the balls to vote one way or another, or even to state your preference to vote 3rd party. You’re attempting to hid under the dividing line and then you want to take the moral high ground when pushed by Chris’s logic and reason. Go ahead and wrap yourself in robes of holiness…

  43. #1: Liberals have traditionally maintained a double standard. They can talk about the flaws of the opposition but never about the much greater flaws, even those EXACT SAME FLAWS of those they support themselves!
    #2: Straw man arguments all the way.
    The article stated that those who support trump support him as a person as well as President. That isn’t true. The election was about the presidency, not about the individual’s perfection 10 years ago. The election did not sanction any wrongdoing by Trump 10+ years ago. He admitted what he said, he said he regretted it, and that he had changed. Hillary, on the other hand, never admitted to any wrongdoing. Hence, we can assume she has not repented. Christianity promotes forgiveness, especially when one has repented. Totally in character for a non Christian liberal to attempt to use a mis-characterization of another’s religion as a straw man argument.

    • ckratzer

      January 6, 2017 at 8:14 pm

      Roger, appreciate your comments. 1) article did not state what you declare it does, it raises a lot of questions. 2) This article is not about Hillary nor does it address her. Let’s stick to the issues and not put words into the article.

  44. And it’s not just abortion, of course. The Democrat Party, as you know, also considers the deconstruction of traditional marriage to be one of its crowning achievements. Meanwhile, Jesus explicitly defined marriage as a covenant between a man and a woman (Matthew 19:5), and Scripture more than once condemns homosexual relationships as “degrading,” “unrighteous,” and “depraved” (1 Corinthians 6:9, Romans 1:26). Granted, the Bible condemns all forms of fornication — homosexual or otherwise — and many (all?) Christians of every political persuasion have struggled to obey these difficult commandments. But can we, as Christians, fundamentally deny God’s authority in this area? It is one thing to stumble, but can we say, “Man can do what he pleases in the realm of sexuality and it is not a sin because God was mistaken”? Yes, we can certainly say that, but can we say it as Christians?

    This is what the Democrat Party stands for now. It asserts the absolute supremacy of the human will. It strives for a society where the whims of the individual not only override every previously existing law, institution, and tradition, but are celebrated as sacrosanct. Say what you want about that, but you cannot say that it is Christian.

    Perhaps nothing better encapsulates the new Democratic creed than its most recent cause du jour, transgenderism. Although the Bible tells us that we were made male and female (Genesis 5:2), the Democrat Party declares that a man exercises total agency over his own biology, and that citizens should be forced by law to recognize and affirm his self-centered delusions.

    Speaking of forcing by law, the Democrat Party has, over the past several years, attempted to stamp out and destroy the very faith you claim to profess. It says not only that the institution of marriage should be opened to gays, but that Christians ought to be forced by the State to participate. It says not only that abortion should be legal and celebrated, but that Christian companies, Christian individuals, and even nuns should be forced by the State to fund the abortion industry and pay for contraceptives and abortifacients.

    So, can you be a Christian and agree with the Democrats on all of these points? The answer is clearly no. Agreeing with them means rather forcefully disagree with God. Can you, then, disagree with the Democrats on all of these points and still be a Democrat? Well, outside of the elderly and the fantastically ignorant, I have not found a single Democrat who does oppose the Party’s agenda in all of these areas.

    If I ever located such a misguided specimen, I would ask them why they vote for, and claim membership in, a party that is so single mindedly dedicated to undermining their faith, killing the innocent, normalizing deviancy and perversion, and restricting the liberty of their brothers and sisters in Christ. I would tell this person that it’s probably time to choose between the two. One or the other. You simply can’t believe in both anymore.

    • How is it that you are equating a political organization and a government to a religion? Why do the right-wing religious zealots continue to try and draw equalization between the religious component of marriage or any other aspect of personal choice and the legal component of the same choice? EVERYTHING you have written speaks to giving law to religious beliefs, some of which I share. There is however, no legal reason why two men can’t marry, a woman can’t choose to have an abortion, or a man can’t decide they believe they are a woman. I don’t find anywhere in the bible God saying that “man” shall pass a law forcing anyone to believe in God or follow the religious beliefs that God expresses.

      You want to legislate “man’s” free will out of everything that you don’t agree with. I find that interesting since everything that is decreed by God and promised through the delivery of Christ is based on choice. “Man’s” very first choice was to eat from the Tree of Knowledge, because “he” had free will. God/Christ does not reach out and save you, you choose to be saved through free will. The path of salvation is not forced on you, you choose to walk the path through free will.

      I am a Christian (though I am struggling to use that word to describe myself given the current state of Christianity) and a Democrat. I have no issues being both of those things. The reason I have no issue being both of those things is because I understand the Democratic Party is not a religion and has no impact on my relationship with God. You say the Democratic Party is forcing everyone to leave behind their faith and beliefs…. really? Do you think the Democratic Party is so powerful that they can keep God out of my life?

      What I see in the Democratic Party is a group that believes in “man’s” ability to exercise their own free will of choice. They are not trying to legislate that everyone is required to marry a same-sex partner or have homosexual sex or claim to be transgender. They are not even purporting to agree with the decisions of the individuals to do so, only that they have the right to make the choice. The basic principle of being pro-CHOICE is that I believe it is not my place, nor the place of government, to dictate any of those choices to “man”. Where as you would fall into what I call anti-CHOICE, as you would rather legislate your version of religious belief on everyone even if they don’t share that belief, thus removing their ability to choose their own direction just as God and Christ state it should be.

      So why aren’t you lobbying for it to be against the law to get divorced? Or commit adultery? Or have sex before marriage? Or covet thy neighbor’s wife? There are seven deadly sins that don’t have laws against them. Why aren’t they illegal? God says the only sin that can never be forgiven is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. (But if you speak against the Holy Spirit, you can never be forgiven. That sin will be held against you forever.” — Mark 3:28-29). Wow, God says everything else can be forgiven (even homosexuality and abortion), but speaking against the Holy Spirit is held against you forever. So why aren’t you spearheading a campaign to jail or put to death everyone that says “God damn it” or curses God?

      Two men choosing to get married does not in any way, shape, or form impact my relationship with Christ. That is their choice, I don’t have to agree with it. If I decided to marry or have sex with another man, then I am pretty sure that would impact my relationship with Christ. But you know what not in any different way they any other sin I commit (and we ALL commit them) because in God’s eyes all sin is equal. The “religion” of Christianity doesn’t have to agree with it or even recognize it as legitimate. However, that has nothing to do with the legality of it in relationship to LAW. What I am commanded to do by Christ is love those two men and show them the love of Christ and share with them my beliefs in a non-judgmental way. Then it is up to them and God how things go from there. But that is not good enough for those like you. Instead, you feel the need not to only share “religion” with others but that it is your personal responsibility to force them to believe what you believe on your timetable and you want to do that by passing laws making them conform to your beliefs.

      So you have met one of what you call a “misguided specimen”. And I have explained to you why not only I am what I am, but why I have NO ISSUE being what I am. So now I have something to say to you… I think it is time for your to choose between your religion and your party. Because you can’t say you are a follower of Christ, and a believer in Christ’s teachings if everything you do is counter to those same teachings. Christ says that we are just the planters of seeds. We don’t save anyone! We don’t get to judge the heart of “man”. We don’t get to force people to be saved. We don’t get to force them to believe. The only one that gets to do that is God, through the teachings of Christ. Christ gave us two commandments “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” So you need to decide if you are going to be a Christian that follows those directives or are you going to be a Repulbican that has taken it upon himself to legislate conformity to salvation? How do you vote for, and claim membership in, a party that is so single mindedly dedicated to undermining FREE WILL as ordained by a God you claim to follow?

      “I would tell this person that it’s probably time to choose between the two. One or the other. You simply can’t believe in both anymore.”

    • John Pelkey wrote;

      Speaking of forcing by law, the Democrat Party has, over the past several years, attempted to stamp out and destroy the very faith you claim to profess.

      [TomSlapsFace thinking, “Dang! And all this time I thought it was the Evangelical Circus destroying the very faith in the past 50 years by selling out to the zeitgeist of CONSUMERISM.”]

    • John pelkey

      “It says not only that the institution of marriage should be opened to gays, but that Christians ought to be forced by the State to participate. ”

      Wow! I truly hope that one day, if your son or daughter is desperately sick, and needs a specialized medical procedure to save their life, that the only doctor available isn’t a married homosexual. Because the fact is that by using that person’s services, you’re providing them an income that helps pay for their homosexual “lifestyle”.

      “It says … that Christian companies,… should be forced by the State to fund the abortion industry and pay for contraceptives and abortifacients.”

      In other words, violate their Biblical Principles ™. I would point out, however, that the Bible also reads “the wages of him that is hired shall not abide with thee all night until the morning” (Lev 19:13). I guess that Biblical Principles only apply if they don’t affect a company’s bottom line:

  45. This election was a “lesser of two evils” election. So many people were voting against the other candidate.
    That said, Trump was a better match for conservative Christians.
    1. He was pro-life. Pro-choice supporters consistently under-rate how big a deal this is. To pro-lifers, abortion is killing babies, and Clinton supported abortion into the ninth month; that is, she said it would be better to kill the baby rather than induce labor and give it up for adoption.
    That’s an almost insurmountable negative to overcome.
    2. Trump was for freedom of religion. He seemed to respect that people shouldn’t have to participate in activities they think are morally wrong, like homosexual weddings, or abortion.
    3. Trump, while often crass, vulgar, basically a jerk, seemed to be an honest businessman (while not above sharp dealing at times), while Clinton, with her secret speeches and donations from foreign countries (some of which seemed to have influenced State department recommendations), had a much higher level of corruption.
    4. Trump seemed to love the American people, even those who might vote for Clinton, while Clinton called those who were against her “deplorables”, “irredeemable”, and other things.
    5. Trump seemed less calculating. He might exaggerate, but you knew where he stood. Clinton said that it was okay to have different public and private views on things.

    So, those were some reasons. Another big one was that Clinton seemed to want to keep going the same way Obama had, only more so.

  46. Very valid points, balanced and Biblical regarding his verbal character.
    Unfortunately, many of us tend to go to extremes with opinions and think that when we vote for someone, it means we are in wholehearted support of all they do. This is not so. We vote for the one which is ‘best’ or at least ‘better’ than the other.
    I did not wholeheartedly support Trump, and was very embarrassed many times.
    So why did i vote for him?

    The short story is that he stood:
    for pro-life, versus murdering innocent babies;

    for pro-Biblical marriage, versus sodomy;

    for pro-religious freedom, versus trying to make me give up my convictions, to support wreckless, godless lifestyles, which the Biblical God says are hell-bound–not acceptable alternative Christian choices;

    for pro-economy, versus making it difficult for me to pay bills & debts. For example, I could not afford health insurance, even with overtime, because of bills and debts–and I am very frugal. So I worked overtime. The government charged me 25% of my pay, for trying to provide and to work off debt, and then an extra $700 health insurance fine because I couldn’t afford my own health insurance in the first place–even though they thought I could.

    Worse than that, my money went to support: the murder of babies (which is not the woman’s body);

    the health of others, while mine and my family suffered and caused me to lose work and eventually my job;

    handouts to others, instead of the gov’t investing in Career Centers and job placement;

    then telling my children to not pray, during public school lunch time, to the only One who changes hearts to love others.

    So, Trump does not promote these nation destoying political agendas, in spite of his immaturity.
    Hillary, on the other hand, would have continued these things. Yes? No? Neither her nor Obama’s eloquent speaking abilities, nor their faithful tax paying record help me to provide for my family, nor raise them morally, rather bring more debt for me, laziness to others, and moral chaos.
    Does the government, we elect, represent the morals of all? No. But I choose to vote for one that will promote the most Biblical, in his action plan, even if his immaturity betrays him.
    He is also surrounding himself with believers and a Vice President who can help him mature. His VP is more careful and more mature in his faith and brings balance.

    • Just a few points you might want to consider about the argument you made.
      1. Trump has flip-flopped between Pro-life and Pro-Choice several times. How do you know he will continue supporting Pro-life?
      2. Biblical marriage also is against fornicators (sex without the purpose of reproduction), adulterers and abusers of themselves (masturbation). Two of these we know for sure that Trump is guilty of.
      3. The religious freedom you are describing is Christian dominance. Religious freedom is for all religions. You don’t get to pick and choose. Prayer isn’t banned in public schools, only forced prayer is banned. Check the law!
      4. How is outsourcing steel for building from China pro-economy for the United States? How is using illegal aliens for labor on your building projects pro-economy for the United States? How is not paying contracted workers pro-economy for the United States? Trump is guilty of all these things.

    • David,
      Your ignorance is absolutely astonishing… Your points are completely idiotic.

      Point 1 – being pro-CHOICE is not equivalent to being pro-abortion AND why does being pro-life only apply to the unborn who are not yet people? And even worse you ignorantly say that your money is going toward abortion, when if fact not a single tax dollar is allowed to be slent on abortion due to a law that is already in place, so not your money isn’t. And by the way Trump has only been pro-life since he started running for president and need your uneducated vote.

      Point 2 – you say he is for biblical marriage… really? What part of your bible includes divorce, adultery, pre-martial sex and coveting in “biblical marriage”? Why is it the only threat to biblical marriage as you ignorantly define it is same-sex marriage which is not specifically called a sin in the bible, but doesn’t include all the the anti-marriage things that are specifically listed as sin in the bible?

      Point 3 – you call him pro religious freedom, again really? Being pro Christianity is not even close to the same as being pro religious freedom. Again your ignorant and narrow-minded definition completely misses Christ two primary points in the New Testament. 1) salvation is a choice not something force on others and 2) you are supposed to love EVERYONE, and yes *gasp* even those who don’t share your ignorant definition of religion.

      Point 4 – you say he is pro-economy… forgive me but is not paying those who do work for you, swindling those who buy from you, cheating those who work with you, and buying from those who you say are killing the ecomony really pro-ecomony? The only thing Trump has demonstrated by his actions that he is would be pro-himself. And whie we are on the subject of the ecomony and where money goes how Christian it is of yout to complain about funding for programs thelp the poor and the least of these… I am sure Christ would have hated any program that did that.

      I am sad that you use the word Christianity to define these ignorant beliefs…

  47. Sure wish you would have put this much effort forward before the election! I didn’t vote for either trump or clinton and I too failed to make sure that a qualified person reached the position of President of the United States of America, but it is our job to make sure trump represents us to the best of our abilities! How come people keep dumping their civic responsibilities on the Christians? And Lord, what is a Christian? This great nation of Christians should dust off their bibles for the answer rather than goggle “Christianity”.

  48. You don’t understand because you don’t want to understand. The Democratic platform is built on defending the killing of innocent humans. That Is SO much more evil and than anything Donald Trump is doing or has done. So Christians voted for him because as evil as he is, (and he is vile, no doubt), to vote for a Democrat is to vote for legalized murder. Until Democrats wake up and fight this atrocity in our nation, the Christians will be forced to vote for low-life like Trump.

    • Darla,

      I think you need to educate yourself a bit on the Democratic platform. I’m not sure where you get the idea that it is built on killing innocent humans. Being pro-choice (I am assuming you are speaking of abortions) is not the same as pro-abortion. Most democrats do not support the idea of abortion. What we do believe is that it is a personal choice. Have you checked the Bible lately on when life begins? Many passages talk about how we existed, in God, before we were made human. But, many passages also state, such as Genesis 2:7, that life begins with breath. That would indicate that life doesn’t begin until after birth/first breath.

      Democrats are for better sex education and making birth control available to all. This is the primary way to prevent unwanted pregnancies and reduce or eliminate the need for abortions. How do you propose to prevent unwanted pregnancies?

      As a Democrat, I value ALL life. That means my heart hurts when anyone’s life is taken. Are you on the same bandwagon against war? That takes many lives. Are you against capital punishment? That is killing. Are you for gun control (not banning, as much of the propaganda says Democrats want)? Assault weapons are not necessary for anyone in the general public to own because they make mass murders easier to commit.

      Again, I urge you to educate yourself on the truth of the Democratic platform rather than follow the extremist propaganda.

  49. I am a recovering catholic his words terrify me. I don’t want war. but now feel it is inevitable. can we please have the classy obama family back ????? PLEASE???????

  50. Because, most likely, he represents those who use their Christianity as a facade for their true inner selves, the selves that are basically reflected in everything Donald Trump says and does. Because if Donald Trump was truly a Christian, it would show in everything he says and does, and very few people would have a problem with him.

  51. Why? Simple. He’s promised to appoint judges who will declare abortion and marital equality illegal. That’s all that matters.

    I was surprised to see that you failed to call him out for being not only a serial adulterer, but for being twice-divorced and twice-remarried. Jesus said “If a man divorces his wife and marries another he commits adultery” (Lk 16:18). Yet the Christian community not only gave him a pass on this, they embraced him as the hope for their plan to restore America to “righteousness”.

    You’re trying to be understanding. I have a different take on this issue you’ve addressed: Jesus said nothing about homosexuality. But he sure had a lot to say about hypocrisy.

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